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Community Helper * Member Since 2005-08-28
posté February 18, 2014, 17:17:22 | #1
Deleted. Deleted.


This post has been edited by JerryDB - May 18, 2015, 13:08:35.
Reason for edit : Updated
posté February 25, 2014, 17:04:53 | #2
Amazing thanks for taking the time to explain everything in such detail ill will test this out on my feca i was clueless but now i understood a lot of stuff


This post has been edited by [MOD]Meka - March 02, 2014, 15:40:20.
Reason for edit : Too long quote.
posté February 25, 2014, 21:57:01 | #3
mmm thanks for the guide but pls consider re-reading it and maybe redoing some parts, some skill effects have the opposite effect that you mentioned here, fecablades gives defense and lowers damage and heals, not the other way, so for tanking is a must, and you said is not good for tanking, you said that having 330% resistance makes use of Refection to 100% (i think you meant having 300 lock), you say having % on stats that are not % based too. Im not trying to defame your work, im trying to help you see some mistakes n_n thanks for the effort

(also... i think 400 lock is too low to lock the most recent bosses)


Community Helper * Member Since 2005-08-28
posté February 27, 2014, 02:29:34 | #4
Your welcome.

Thank you for your input I will update the guide in a few days.

What I meant about fecablade is by maths I have a choice of fecablades glyph armor or just normal armor for me gained by fecabo. I would choose fecabo.

In my tests using fecablade glyph armor whilst increasing my resistance, it lowered my damage therefore lowing my earth armors and my usually abitltity to take pretty much zero damage. Using the armor I found I started to take damage.

I ran the numbers on both the test server and the real server fighting the strongest monster there.

I went with 400 lock as these are the bosses I want to lock.
Master Skkkdoku 275 dodge
Emperor lenald 295 dodge
Black Wabbit Emiw 285 dodge

If you wanted dragon pig you would need more lock.


posté February 27, 2014, 20:37:18 | #5
I am going to side with Jerry on the Fecablades Armor. It seems to me that the Feca Shield is more valuable than Blade armor. When properly shielded, I take little or no damage and what little gets through is not a big deal with 300+ resists.

As for lock, I am going all out but for the bosses listed, I think you could go as low as 350 lock.

Teleportation Flux is awesome as are all of the passives.

I am not sure if Glyph or Armor really needs to be max for this build but certainly needs a few levels into it. At level 7, the cost is down to 1 AP. Do we need more? No LOS is nice but most of the glyphs/armors I want to use are LOS.


posté February 28, 2014, 11:49:39 | #6
This is exactly my reason leaving it for now at 7. It is pointless to max it. At least for tank.

The only armors you can think of using losless perk are the flaming, bubble and drip armors.
For Glyphs its just avalanche and phelles ones.

Well dod is capricious thing, my Cherry has around 420-430 lock and had a terrible slug-it-out with northern chafers who ran away from her twice or three times in row, despite having ~ -180 dod against her.

Well I use both fecabo and fecablades. Sometimes you just can't reach with blades, and arrow armor is quite useful. It supports lack of mp that not endgame Fecas have. I never use blade armor. My resists are high enought, while there is lack of dmg ;p


posté February 28, 2014, 18:10:30 | #7
Hi, i play a feca in remington with a quite different build.

I think you have a nice guide with some quite interesting and not necessarily obvious information (for example i think it is great to point out the importance of drip armour to a new player) and believe this guide can be very helpfull for a lot of players. However, i would like to point out a few reasoning’s i believe are flawed to perhaps improve on the guide.
------------------------------------
Firstly, although indeed one can argue that 400 lock is sufficient for "most monsters", its not just dragonpig you cannot lock reliably at that value.
I’m sure you are well aware that any tank has 50% chance to lock when their lock is equal to a enemies dodge, and gain 0.5% additional lock chance for each point of lock they have in advantage over the monster's dodge. Thus 90 points advantage are necessary for 95%lock chance (and it is my lasting impression that when someone says that a tank "can lock" a enemy, they are saying "he has maximum lock chance for that enemy" and not just a decent possibility of doing so).

That said, i can recall of a few that would exceed 400 lock requirement:

Cloudy thingamastrich 325 dodge (requires 415 lock)
celestial Strich 375 dodge (requires 465 lock)
Mrs freeze: 359 dodge (requires 449 lock)
Hagen daz 367 dodge (requires 457 lock) - not that anyone tries to tank him.
Sylargh 489 dodge (requires 579 lock)
Gwand viziew 380 dodge (requires 470 lock)
Dragonpig 575 (requires 665 lock)
Wa Wabbit 625 (requires 715lock)

One UB, 2 level 95 monsters and 5 dungeon bosses.
Naturally in some cases groups would fight bosses without 95% chance of lock (wa wabbit for example), but more is always better.
Additionally, i am certain there are monsters i don’t remember or that have abilities that reduce our dodge or increase their own lock that might also pose a problem for a tank with 400 lock.
---------------------------------------
On another subject, you seem to be aware that tri element spell choices with 2 high spells on each element give highest resistances, but i cant see why to chose natural attack over meteorite. Of course meteorite is terrible armour to cast on yourself, but you can cast it on allies that don’t care for block reduction (specially since you are tanking for them). Natural attack is just damage, and damage will be horrible anyhow.
-------------------------------------
I also disagree on the usefulness of fecablades. It is true it makes shields weaker by reducing damage, and you can use that ap for additional shields. But which is best would depend on the opponent, and a situational ability is not a bad one.
Naturally, if your resistances are already equal to or higher then the enemies damage%, resistance armour is pointless. Additionally, if your shield can absorb the full damage, its also best to do so then to increase resistances to reduce damage but have a smaller shield.
However, in a situation that you will be attacked many times (either by multiple enemies or by the same one repeatedly), in a way that they would break your shield early, having higher resist to reduce the damage from all these attacks is more valuable then shielding just one.
------------------------------------------------
Also, saving points on glyph or armor, as pointed by other posters, as well as in Refection, can mean being able to take valuable points in another specialty spell.
-----------------------------------------
I’m not trying to devalue your proposed build, I even can see it as much more efficient then my own for certain content. I simply disagree for which content this build is valid. I think that trying to gain higher damage and stronger shields at the cost of lock will make your build better then my dedicated tank build at fighting lower level monsters and for leveling content, and specially when soloing. However, as i pointed out above, there is a significant number of end-game bosses you cannot lock with 400 lock. Additionally, the proposed damage increases will not increase your damage output in high level content because enemy resistances will lower your damage to base damage anyhow. More damage would just give a slightly stronger shield.

If someone intends to be a max level tank i personally cant see them being okay with a build that cannot fulfil the proposed role in 4 important dungeons and 1 UB with their character.
This is why i found it very strange when you said that this build is designed for fighting bosses and believe it would be more accurate and honest to say it is a build designed for soloing and leveling. Not to imply that the intention was to deceive, maybe just because you still have some content to experience at higher levels.


This post has been edited by YetAnotherNewbie - February 28, 2014, 18:13:06.
Community Helper * Member Since 2005-08-28
posté March 09, 2014, 15:39:53 | #8
Thank you everyone for your help especially YetAnotherNewbie.

I will be honest I am not running the highest content and for my build I am being greedy I basically want as little lock as possible with as much earth damage as possible.

I have tried to update and reply within the guide itself. As correctly stated it was not viable for most boss so I have changed it. I will add I have left out a pet and other bonuses so you could easily get +60 if more lock from other sources making the build more like +460 lock but I thought I would leave it up to each person how much lock they want to go with.

Also if anyone wants to post there build I am sure we would all be grateful as lots of people keep saying they are happy with the feca and even OP yet no builds.

If someone wants to write about smithmaging lock that would also be very helpful.


posté March 10, 2014, 13:12:26 | #9

Quote (JerryDB @ 09 March 2014 15:39) *
Thank you everyone for your help especially YetAnotherNewbie.

I will be honest I am not running the highest content and for my build I am being greedy I basically want as little lock as possible with as much earth damage as possible.

I have tried to update and reply within the guide itself. As correctly stated it was not viable for most boss so I have changed it. I will add I have left out a pet and other bonuses so you could easily get +60 if more lock from other sources making the build more like +460 lock but I thought I would leave it up to each person how much lock they want to go with.

Also if anyone wants to post there build I am sure we would all be grateful as lots of people keep saying they are happy with the feca and even OP yet no builds.

If someone wants to write about smithmaging lock that would also be very helpful.
Happy to be of assistance

Um, im not sure if you had me in mind when you asked for other build suggestions... Im just a bit reluctant to post a short description of what i do because im always a bit scared someone might say its dumb. People over the internet can be super mean sometimes. I guess if i were to say what i do id wanna write a bunch about why i chose this or that and write a suuuuppper big text, and that would be alot of work and prolly need a whole new thread. I dont think ill be doing that anytime soon

And, whats smithmaging?
Runes? Is that a dofus term?


This post has been edited by YetAnotherNewbie - March 10, 2014, 13:35:51.
posté March 10, 2014, 15:38:08 | #10
I'll give you a quick rundown on my Feca build. I don't lock tank or take dmg for my team in any way. I shield buff allies and give AP to other DPS with a higher dmg% and better specialties.

Basic 10 control build.

Spells: Steam and Wave. Feca Staff and Defensive Orb.
Specialties: Peace Armor, Teleportation, Inversion, Glyph or Armor, Feca Master
Stats: 1Ap, 1-2MP, crit

The gear I wear changes almost every fight. I often swap my boots for Viddhartas when I'm trying to give 10 Feca Staff glyphs to allies. The other common changes are swapping out pieces to alter my Initiative order or increase PP. When performing the shield role for DP I drop a few control and maximize my water shield.

Casting Feca staff on yourself is inefficient. You only gain the buff for two turns. Casting it on an ally means 3 turns of extra ap. This is due to the timing of when glyphs lose charges. It takes 3 turns to get 9-20ap worth of glyphs in play and then it is expensive to maintain. But the ap gained per turn is massive.

Example: Lets assume my glyphs average 10ap a turn and I place it on a Panda. So I've basically traded my 10ap turn for someone elses. On Panda's turn spend two of that ap to toss another ally who goes before the Feca on the glyph. I've now turned my 10ap into an 18ap turn. Repeat the process as much as you'd like. Have a Masq summon his double on that glyph. It's very powerful in the right hands.


posté March 18, 2014, 02:07:12 | #11
What gear I can get to achieve the maximum lock possible?

-Rizarealm


Community Helper * Member Since 2005-08-28
posté March 18, 2014, 21:57:21 | #12
YetAnotherNewbie, my friends criticise my builds all the time its fine build are just opinions but I can understand a hesitation in posting builds but with our little community I think any builds even crazy one's are welcome.

Gynrei, thank you for sharing that sound awesome. It reminds me of the good old days when feca's could give 12 AP to a whole team then GG any content. I was tempted to make a support feca but you have really sold me on the idea and I am sure its tons of fun.

Hey Rizarealm,

Here is a lock build I am not 100% sure if it is the maximum possible.

Adding in passive, guild bonuses and adding lock to the items via runes is the way to go .

Also there is some plus lock food .


This post has been edited by JerryDB - March 18, 2014, 22:04:41.
posté March 19, 2014, 14:50:58 | #13
That is the best lock set as far as I'm aware. I haven't looked at new drops from Saharash. I almost never gear solely for lock but instead aim for the max i need for a particular encounter. I also don't have all the stuff.

Here is the budget DP lock build I use.

Another budget build with more lock but you lose canine dodge.

They do require another Feca or Xelor in the team to give you ap each turn. Or a class that removes dodge. You can substitute the belt for any easy to obtain belt with a rune slot. One advantage of these builds is that you only need to be 119 roughly. The first build needs lock food, the second does not. They are also easier to rune because the boots are only level 100 and the belt could be blow up shorts at 100 or mini skirt at 104.

Giving AP is more fun if you control one of the characters on the glyph  


posté March 19, 2014, 23:34:33 | #14
My set is a bit different, but i was trying to go for a "best overall tanky setup", rather then just maximum lock. Of course lock weighs alot.

Im pretty proud of my stats. I haven’t seen any tank of any class i thought was clearly stronger then me.



I was however cheating a bit on that first screenshot. As you can see below i had a +40 lock food and a +12 resistance food. My actual lock is 604 out of combat, 704 in combat.
I have some room for improvements however. Im putting runes on a new shield that will have 8 lock advantage over my current one, and my lock from runes can still increase by 22.

Therefore, when im the "best possible" set (in my view), i will have 734 in combat without food.




These are my items:


Its a pretty standard tanky set. The main differences i noticed between the set you guys suggested is that i choose to use Turq Tutu over wobotic undewweaw, and hagen helm over those wobot glasses.
In my opinion, the glasses give too little block (would require stating more to have 100), and less lock then hagen when you consider the set bonus from helm+ammy. Wobotic might still be nice to keep around case you need a bit more control or ini for a fight, but i think that as a standard set hagen is still better.
And tutu gives control and resists over the undewweaw. Undewweaw has interesting ini for a ini set, and a second rune spot, but those wobotic items are muuuuuch harder to rune then my lower level picks and a player that isint extremely rich might end up having higher stats from the lower level items with cheaper runes.

The imperial defender is the shield i mentioned above i could upgrade (to the wo shield). Ive been waiting to do so because my imperial is fully runed and is still worth a bit more resists, plus because i think imperial looks awesome and wo is ugly (which might actually be the main reason).


And to finish showing off:

Obviously this one is cheating tons. I had like 300 bonus lock from tormentor.


This post has been edited by YetAnotherNewbie - March 19, 2014, 23:41:54.
Reason for edit : english!
posté March 20, 2014, 14:40:47 | #15

Quote (YetAnotherNewbie @ 19 March 2014 23:34) *
My set is a bit different, but i was trying to go for a "best overall tanky setup", rather then just maximum lock. Of course lock weighs alot.

Despite what your username suggests I've been very impressed with your posts since you've started posting on the forums YAN. I wish I could hit those numbers but the sacrifice to have 10 control is killer.

I still use many items in the 100-120 range because they are easier to rune. I'm only now just starting to go after the higher level gear and rune them. For instance I'm very content with a Bloodthirsty runed to +10% over all the cawwot daggers. It's general dmg so it will fit any build and as a legendary item still competes with the higher level items in game. I've made it a habit to rune legendary items to +10 because they last such a long time.

Hagen is certainly a better all round set. Good resist, lock, block and it actually has earth dmg. The only things missing imo are crits and control. I also value initiative but that's secondary most times. Those are the stats I'm after as a Feca. But if you search for items containing those... you'll be disappointed.

My only question is why the Jarno? I see most builds containing that but i feel 35hp, 2lock, 1block, and 2res is not worth 25% earth/water dmg from another runed rocky fist.


posté March 20, 2014, 16:05:15 | #16

Quote (Gynrei @ 20 March 2014 14:40) *

Quote (YetAnotherNewbie @ 19 March 2014 23:34) *
My set is a bit different, but i was trying to go for a "best overall tanky setup", rather then just maximum lock. Of course lock weighs alot.

Despite what your username suggests I've been very impressed with your posts since you've started posting on the forums YAN. I wish I could hit those numbers but the sacrifice to have 10 control is killer.

My only question is why the Jarno? I see most builds containing that but i feel 35hp, 2lock, 1block, and 2res is not worth 25% earth/water dmg from another runed rocky fist.

when i chose this account name was not aware other people got to see it, and i was just starting.
And naturally a control build would have a different look! Im leveling a second feca to play support and she wont have almost any lock or resistance.

And chosing the Jarno is just a natural consequence of the stats i deem valuable in my tank build. My philosophy is that just as a DD wont care if his items have +healing, i dont care if mine have +damage. To me tanking is about having resistance, lock, health and block, so i value these above damage.

Of course i am aware damage increases our earth shields, but a 25% dmg increase is just 25 more damage to our shields *when we spend a full turn shielding* (which for me ends up not being often), and my intuition tells me that the extra starting health and damage reduction from resistance (from the item and from stat points i save with that block) are more helpfull.


posté March 20, 2014, 20:05:20 | #17

Quote (Gynrei @ 19 March 2014 14:50) *
Giving AP is more fun if you control one of the characters on the glyph

This multi-glyph ap supply seems to good to be true. When I tried it on my xelor, in third turn of fight I had 30ap (with SkaleMM and xel's tricks). And my feca isn't even optimal build for ap supply.
Is it confirmed that this isn't a bug or devs' mistake? Ankama tends to forbid effect stacking for buffing spells.


Community Helper * Member Since 2005-08-28
posté March 22, 2014, 00:31:12 | #18
They spend two years or so doing this revamp.
As I said at the start of this guide I think feca's are amazing and Ankama loves their nerf hammer so get the most use of out it while you can. I could be wrong they may never nerf it who knows (soon to be a 10 year Ankama player).


This post has been edited by JerryDB - March 22, 2014, 21:14:01.
posté March 24, 2014, 18:47:30 | #19

Quote (semcorda @ 20 March 2014 20:05) *

Quote (Gynrei @ 19 March 2014 14:50) *
Giving AP is more fun if you control one of the characters on the glyph

This multi-glyph ap supply seems to good to be true. When I tried it on my xelor, in third turn of fight I had 30ap (with SkaleMM and xel's tricks). And my feca isn't even optimal build for ap supply.
Is it confirmed that this isn't a bug or devs' mistake? Ankama tends to forbid effect stacking for buffing spells.

I recall seeing it stated Ankama thought the AP was fair given what it costs the Feca. It takes a few turns before it's effective and monsters can always knock you off glyphs so there is always potential for wasted turns. Team mates can always hinder this game play. I've had people sac or move my character off glyphs thinking they were saving me which caused me to lose all that AP. YOu also can't stray far from the Feca making this a turret play style.

Having another DPS in place of the Feca is more reliable and mobile as they always have more freedom in their turn.


Quote (YetAnotherNewbie @ 20 March 2014 16:05) *
Of course i am aware damage increases our earth shields, but a 25% dmg increase is just 25 more damage to our shields *when we spend a full turn shielding* (which for me ends up not being often), and my intuition tells me that the extra starting health and damage reduction from resistance (from the item and from stat points i save with that block) are more helpfull.

It isn't always true that a few more res will out do the shields extra effect but if you find you don't shield often I'd go for defense as well. If you spend more time teleporting and casting armors you certainly don't need offensive stats. The extra res is a passive bonus that's always in effect and working for you.


posté March 24, 2014, 19:29:28 | #20
For those who havent seen, the nerf hammer has hit Feca Staff, 1/turn use now on Wed maintenance. Ofc, feca is still powerful unless all you used it for was the AP. Plus you can still give someone 3-6ap a turn once you get the set up rolling, while still provoking 2 monsters or building up some more shield or laying down other armors/glyphs with the AP you have left over.


This post has been edited by smallz117 - March 24, 2014, 19:31:40.