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Class Revamp - Feca
Tofurby on Diet * Member Since 2013-02-16
posté December 17, 2013, 00:46:40 | #41
Confused on +100% lock bonus, do we get double lock or +100 lock or what...?


Speechless Crobak * Member Since 2011-06-28
posté December 17, 2013, 01:08:02 | #42
+100 lock, double lock would be *+100% final lock"


Mister Winter Fashion Victim 2012 * Member Since 2012-12-16
posté December 17, 2013, 01:16:55 | #43

Quote (0Cataclyst0 @ 17 December 2013 00:46) *
Confused on +100% lock bonus, do we get double lock or +100 lock or what...?

Double lock, up to +100. If you have 100 lock, you get an additional 100. If you have 150 lock, you still only get 100.

• Mango


Bellaphone Lover * Member Since 2013-07-28
posté December 17, 2013, 01:19:41 | #44

Quote (Gynrei @ 16 December 2013 22:34) *

Quote (Flaming-June @ 16 December 2013 22:11) *
1. Meteor Show and Fecastopheles glyphs are offly redundant.
2. Fecastopheles damage, minimum range, and los required doesn't justify it existing, as Flaming Carpet x2 is better in every single way:

a. Flaming Carpet x2 is the same ap cost as Fecastopheles
b. Flaming Carpet x2 has more range and no minimum range in comparison to Fecastopheles
c. Flaming Carpet x2 has the same base damage as Fecastopheles


So why would you ever use Fecastopheles?
Why even get Fecastopheles when you can just get Meteor Shower for a glyph with similar damage that doesn't cost nearly as much ap?

Please make Fecastopheles unique and useful and worth the horrible range/minimum range it has. :/

More so on the fire branch, I'd like to see the new damage fire glyph in action because I'm looking at it now and not seeing them being worth using over direct hits from fire attacks.

They are completely different spells. Your A&B are correct but C isn't. Carpet has more base dmg. I think you meant to compare Meteor as that is roughly the same base dmg.

Fecastopheles is the only of the three not linear. Flaming Carpet is an Armor. Meteor has a 2 circle lyph that looks to affect a single cell upon activation. Meteor is 4ap while Fecastopheles is 6ap. These make for completely different combos. Fecastopheles has a 1 circle glyph and upon activation has a 2 cell AoE.
I'm using the level 100 comparisons 45 + 45 vs 90, which I believe is better to base it off of than level 200. The fact that it ends up even weaker is yet another negative though that I am glad you brought up. Meteor has nothing to do with what I said in that comparison; I only mentioned Meteor as an alternative to Fecastopheles if someone wanted to have a damage glyph.

It not being linear is in no way a justification for it being such a pointless and inferior spell to Flaming Carpet. I will note that you are right in that the glyphs are slightly different in their effect target size though, but that doesn't make up for the direct use of the spell being so severely limited for the amount of damage it does. The only thing I can see making it worth existing at all is if you still didn't need los (which you do now), which even then, makes you prone to anyone just walking up to you to negate one of the spells you depend on.

And, unless you are suggesting something crazy and absolutely inferior with what we are seeing here, that being a pure fire feca, you won't be able to get Fecastopheles without sacrificing something more useful in every way. With how weak fire glyphs look, and fire/earth and fire/water having way higher base damage, a pure fire feca would be a disappointment in comparison to any other feca. If Fecastopheles was made more useful (rather than being near useless) and if fire glyphs don't turn out as bad as they look on paper, then maybe that would be a viable option.

Regardless of that though, if a spell is obviously useless and inferior before a revamp's implementation, it's kind of obvious that it should be pointed out so that it can be readjusted before it's applied. u w u;

And let's be real too, there was absolutely no reason at all for Fecastopheles to be made worse than how it is currently, it's a nerf just for the sake of nerfing; it being how it was before in addition to the new spells would at most, make fire feca do almost as much base damage as fire/earth and fire/water, with having the option to build around not needing los. I hope Ankama sees how ridiculous a nerf to Fecastopheles is, especially when considering the other branches in comparison with this revamp. :/
 


Featherless Piwi * Member Since 2008-06-21
posté December 17, 2013, 01:35:25 | #45
So, I don't understand how this revamp does anything for water fecas. It DOES buff the other trees, making earth and lock synergise very well together, I don't really know much about fire, so I can't really say how much the change affected it aside from making it a better tank. The main thing that got better for water fecas is the AP support it can give now. Xelors already take this role, not to mention what if you don't want to be a feca that's purely support tank? Not to mention, not many of the passive spells synergise with water. Why would you want lock when all of you highest damage per AP spells have a minimum range of 2? Literally 4 of the passive spells give, or rely on locking down the enemy in the square right next to you. Teleport also costs wakfu now, so if you want to kite without a ton of dodge you have to give up glyphs/armors.

All this aside, I would like if the animation for bubble could look similar to the animation in Dofus upon the revamp. If nothing in the first paragraph is changed, I'd be happy playing water Feca with the animation change.

Thanx~


Mister Winter Fashion Victim 2012 * Member Since 2012-12-16
posté December 17, 2013, 01:54:45 | #46
I believe fire and water are supposed to directly synergize. You can retroactively re-position your fire glyphs (which look like they do fairly good damage still) by using water spells on enemies, making it so you don't have to re-cast the glyphs repeatedly which would otherwise consume quite a bit of AP. By doing this you can damage enemies while also punishing the ground beneath their feet.

• Mango


posté December 17, 2013, 02:18:38 | #47
hoo... i think the current feca spell is good, quite versatile and each element serve it purpose...

btw i like the belligerence idea for this class, since all other shield class should have provoke! but i have some idea to make it not too OP, here is


Quote

Belligerence

Level 0 cost: 6 AP / max level cost: 2 AP
*Provoke chance level 0: 30% / max level 70%, on some boss the chance is lowering to 10% / 50%
Range level 0: 1-1 / range max level : 1 - 4 *(cross shape area) range can't be modified
*All levels effects: On monsters: will have "provoke" debuff will last for 1 turn, make the Feca their priority target
On player: will have "provoke" debuff will last for 1 turn, lower the attack power 10% / 90%
*The debuff will terminate if monster or player, attack or cast spell on feca who cast the belligence
so basically it's like AP+MP remover,

on group pvp some class can spend some cheap AP to remove the debuff, some class who dont have cheap AP will piss off and your friend will be glad you are on team

in 1 on 1 pvp, this can be usefull or not, since it's based on chance.. maybe it usefullness depend on who you are dealing with..

on PVE maybe the feca will spend most of his AP to provoke boss, great deal...


This post has been edited by aswdryCool - December 17, 2013, 02:44:08.
Not so Hairy Moon * Member Since 2010-12-20
posté December 17, 2013, 03:28:42 | #48
Maybe this will actually pot this time.

From an unbiased viewpoint it's a nice and well needed revamp. Though I do have a question. Spells like Fecastopheles that have "Glyph Area" in their description, is it that they have the same AOE when cast normally, that they would as a Glyph, or does it only represent the size of the Glyph?

If it is the AOE of the spells when cast normally then several of the concerns, such as being unable to hit adjacent enemies with Fecastopheles, would be remedied. If not then the class would, from the info here, lacks AOE attacks outside of Glyphs. And since the damage from the Glyphs is so much less than casting the spell normally, having to rely on Glyphs alone for AOE damage, might cause more concerns to arise.


posté December 17, 2013, 03:52:27 | #49

Quote (Jinouga @ 17 December 2013 03:28) *
Maybe this will actually pot this time.

From an unbiased viewpoint it's a nice and well needed revamp. Though I do have a question. Spells like Fecastopheles that have "Glyph Area" in their description, is it that they have the same AOE when cast normally, that they would as a Glyph, or does it only represent the size of the Glyph?

If it is the AOE of the spells when cast normally then several of the concerns, such as being unable to hit adjacent enemies with Fecastopheles, would be remedied. If not then the class would, from the info here, lacks AOE attacks outside of Glyphs. And since the damage from the Glyphs is so much less than casting the spell normally, having to rely on Glyphs alone for AOE damage, might cause more concerns to arise.

  1. Atm all Feca Fire spells are all single target.
  2. Fire glyphs have a one circle AoE when placed on the ground. The glyph triggers when stepped upon.
  3. Once stepped on and triggered, the AoE that hits is a 2 circle AoE around the player who triggered it.
The revamp shows fire spells with "Glyph Zones". These are likely the size of the glyph on the ground that players can step on to trigger. When triggered, the "Glyph Effect" occurs. Such as the 2 circle AoE of Fecastopheles. One person can trigger the effect and hit multiple/surrounding targets.


Community Helper * Member Since 2013-01-13
posté December 17, 2013, 04:11:42 | #50
I'm really excited for this.


Lazy Bow Meow * Member Since 2013-02-02
posté December 17, 2013, 04:23:59 | #51
Write your reply here

why don't make revamp of skills so the fecas could practice their skills and choose what element they want to be now after the revamp hope that there will be restate


Lord Madgobb * Member Since 2010-12-04
posté December 17, 2013, 07:58:10 | #52
Food for Thought:

New Feca is only gaining +110 res over current Feca. However, I get more from using the current version of peace armor.

New Feca can get +100 Lock from their passive. A sac can do the same while reducing an opponents dodge for a much bigger difference.

New Feca can get +65 block. That's essentially -19.5% final dmg. Sac's have +60% HP and their coag absorbs 70% final dmg.

All of the above costs me 4 Passives, 5 if i want 120 lock instead. Leaving most players 2 maybe 3 active specialties. I assume you want glyph or armor. Which one or two are you taking from Taunt, PA, Teleport, and Inversion. If you don't take Inversion you do not get any increase in +elemental dmg%

Most interesting part of the New Feca will be how effective some of these armors are. Some sort of self coag is needed with no HP buff to speak of. And remember, you don't get to take every spell.

So many people are telling me how OP Feca are going to be. Wait and see how PA works first. Other than that a Feca has some decent armors to throw around giving some form of coag and effecting resistance in a negative or positive way.

ALL of these things can not be used on the Feca at once! 


Community Manager * Member Since 2013-07-08
posté December 17, 2013, 08:16:19 | #53
Thank you everyone for all the feedback, keep them coming!

Also please make sure to list any question you may have so that we can share them with the devs to get you the answers.  


Tofurby on Diet * Member Since 2013-02-16
posté December 17, 2013, 12:40:46 | #54
I've always thought this should be added:

New classes only get 1 restat for their revamp. But its too much to ask to have a full build when you leave (the training room isnt very good imo). I think we should get a month to test out the new revamp then get another restat to clean up any issues. This will be more of a problem with feca since you are changing everything about it.


Lazy Bow Meow * Member Since 2006-08-05
posté December 17, 2013, 13:15:50 | #55
ech this revamp sound like less dmg more res not good at all



Ambitious Crackapult * Member Since 2011-12-01
posté December 17, 2013, 13:25:35 | #56

Quote (LordDregoo @ 17 December 2013 13:15) *
ech this revamp sound like less dmg more res not good at all
You do realize a Feca's main role at a glance is normally considered a Tank Class, right?


- Kat


Dokushuuuuu * Member Since 2008-01-09
posté December 17, 2013, 13:29:02 | #57

Quote (kurokat @ 17 December 2013 13:25) *

Quote (LordDregoo @ 17 December 2013 13:15) *
ech this revamp sound like less dmg more res not good at all
You do realize a Feca's main role at a glance is normally considered a Tank Class, right?


- Kat
Exactly... Not every class is focused on having as much dmg as possible and Feca is one of them.


This post has been edited by Rokugatsu - December 17, 2013, 13:29:20.
Bellaphone Lover * Member Since 2011-11-29
posté December 17, 2013, 13:44:58 | #58

Quote (0Cataclyst0 @ 17 December 2013 12:40) *
I've always thought this should be added:

New classes only get 1 restat for their revamp. But its too much to ask to have a full build when you leave (the training room isnt very good imo). I think we should get a month to test out the new revamp then get another restat to clean up any issues. This will be more of a problem with feca since you are changing everything about it.

With the Fogger-Revamp, I got 3 restats the following week, thanks to bugfixes and an a bug with restatting. Might be the same for the Feca


This post has been edited by spacecooky - December 17, 2013, 13:46:05.
Lord Madgobb * Member Since 2010-12-04
posté December 17, 2013, 16:18:10 | #59

Quote (spacecooky @ 17 December 2013 13:44) *

Quote (0Cataclyst0 @ 17 December 2013 12:40) *
I've always thought this should be added:

New classes only get 1 restat for their revamp. But its too much to ask to have a full build when you leave (the training room isnt very good imo). I think we should get a month to test out the new revamp then get another restat to clean up any issues. This will be more of a problem with feca since you are changing everything about it.

With the Fogger-Revamp, I got 3 restats the following week, thanks to bugfixes and an a bug with restatting. Might be the same for the Feca

While that would remedy the situation, I do not like crossing my fingers for this kind of thing.

**Suggestion Sabi**

Maybe Ankama could treat class revamps like Multimen. Have a trial period. On update day, Feca's get their respec and then a week later they get one more as players have now had a chance to test out the new class.


Eccentric Moogrr * Member Since 2006-10-14
posté December 17, 2013, 21:30:04 | #60
I don't like that a lot of the team support is being reduced so greatly. We don't have enough team buffs in this game. The 10% resist to allies is a laughable amount, you should bump that up to at least 20%. Also I didn't see the variety that there is now, you could do a glyph, shield/harmor, or a direct attack. I'm either missing those affects or it has been reduced to one branch. Why is the glyph size being reduced to one cell? The glyph size is already such a small area, shouldn't you be thinking of increasing them for offensive glyphs? I do like that the wakfu cost is being removed from glyphs and shields, that makes them a lot more practical, especially for longer fights. Also remember we already have a fair amount of tanks or locking characters to choose from; Sac, Fogger, Sadi and Panda. I think the focus is too heavily on the general tanky concepts and not enough on the unique tankiness that a feca has to offer, like the increased resistances. Yes block and lock would be great on a feca but I think you guys are being a little heavy handed on the generic tank/lock and not focusing on the heart of what the feca class is!

Anyway that's my two cents!

P.S. The game needs more team supports!