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Doll Link concept - the way it was in its former glory days and the way it should be revamped
Lord Madgobb * Member Since 2011-05-25
posté December 23, 2013, 01:35:20 | #1
Doll Link concept - the way it was in its former glory days and the way it should be revamped This used to be my favourite passive that was combined well with Green Guard and Explodoll before the revamp. I would like to give some food for thought here about this passive. A lot of you can agree that its not worth investing points in this passive now. 10% redirection of dmg is not gonna save anyone when enemy can hit you for 2000 dmg normally.

Therefore with hope for the revamp in mind i will start by sharing my knowledge about this passive former state.

It used to transfer 20% of damage suffered by Sadida to dolls. Each doll was taking 20% of the damage. However it was not reduction of initial dmg (2 dolls were not reducing dmg taken by 40% but by 36% and 3 dolls were not reducing dmg by 60% but by 48.8%). Yes it was still effective even with 3 dolls. The only con of this passive was that it was making dolls die faster. However it was still making Sadida take less dmg and it is Sadida that should not die afterall. Combined with Explodoll it was even welcome for dolls to die and with Green Guard mechanic Sadida was meant to be a punch bag, with wich the Doll Link mechanic was helping Sadida.

The Doll Link that we used to have was simply multiplying the damage received by Sadida by 0.8 per each doll on the field but from the previously reduced dmg by other doll (if there was more then 1 doll). The first doll summoned was taking the most dmg.

On example when we would be normally hit by 1000 damage:

With 1 Doll summoned:
The Sadida take 800 damage.
The Doll take 200 damage.

With 2 Dolls summoned:
The Sadida take 640 damage
The 1st doll take 200 damage
The 2nd doll take 160 damage

With 3 Dolls summoned:
The Sadida take 512 damage
The 1st doll take 200 damage
The 2nd doll take 160 damage
The 3rd doll take 128 damage

I will stop here for now and just make a note that the doll would need to actually survive the hit or else Sadida would end up re-summoning first and 2nd doll over and over again and would never summon even 4th doll. If the doll would have less then 400 HP as the first doll summoned then Doll Link would insta-kill it.

I will skip the details and get to the point with 6 dolls summoned:

With 6 dolls summoned:
The Sadida take 262.144 damage
The 1st doll take 200 damage
The 2nd doll take 160 damage
The 3rd doll take 128 damage
The 4th doll take 102.4 damage
The 5th doll take 81.92 damage
The 6th doll take 65.536 damage

You may notice few things:
1. Each doll always take the same amount of % of dmg depending on the order in wich it was summoned (the initiative order if you prefer).
2. There is effect is more noticable with first dolls summoned. More dolls change the damage % redirection with "weaker" effect. Some may even decide not to bother summoning the 6th or even the 5th doll.

This is how it used to be. Players could obviously try to summon 7th and 8th doll if they were in team with eniripsa and osamodas (due to WP refund mark and osamodas's Leadership "speed bonus") but it was not changing much anyway.

Small note: dolls back then had more HP. The Greedy for example had 28% of Sadida max HP and even back then it was considered as too low (i don't understand why Grou nerfed dolls HP so much when we needed it higher).

Summary:

Pros:
+Sadida was able to be in the middle of the battlefield to support allies while having high survivalability itself.
+Sadida was able to win PvP vs damage dealer classes.
+It had synergy with Explodoll and Green Guard.
+Sadida was able to reduce damage taken by 73.7856% of initial damage wich is similar to Sacrier's Coagulation that reduce damage received by 70%.

Cons:
-The dolls were dieing fast if they were within area of effect of damaging spell togather with Sadida.
-The Sadida had to resummon dolls pretty often because of the low amount of HP on each doll (despite the fact that it was almost 2x higher then now!).
-Sadida had to put much effort to summon dolls and keep dolls alive just for the protection to be active, meanwhile it was not doing much damage in return.

=======================================================

Now what i am mentioning all this? Because i want this mechanic to be brought back to the game. Obviously i would also like for Ankama (or more specificially Grou) to remove the WP from the Doll cost for good too.

How to do this to make things implemented and make it balanced?

The solution is simple to be honest. With the available equipement, 1 pet with control and +2 Control from Knowledge of Dolls the Sadida could reach 12 Control (the fact that there is hardly any equipement with Control that isn't build for Osamodas but for Sadida is an issue for another topic to discuss).

Now if we make each doll take 10% of dmg from Sadida instead of 20%, then having 2x more dolls would be as effective as 6 dolls used to be before the revamp of Doll Link! Brilliant? Let's do some math now:

On example when we would be normally hit by 1000 damage:

With 1 Doll summoned:
The Sadida take 900 damage
The Doll take 100 damage

With 2 Dolls summoned:
The Sadida take 810 damage
The 1st Doll take 100 damage
The 2nd Doll take 90 damage

With 3 Dolls summoned:
The Sadida take 729 damage
The 1st Doll take 100 damage
The 2nd Doll take 90 damage
The 3rd Doll take 81 damage

Following this:

With 6 Dolls summoned:
The Sadida take 531.441 damage
The 1st Doll take 100 damage
The 2nd Doll take 90 damage
The 3rd Doll take 81 damage
The 4th Doll take 72.9 damage
The 5th Doll take 65.61 damage
The 6th Doll take 59.049 damage

At that point if Dolls would still be limited to 6 by the amount of WP on Sadida lets make a summary:

Pros:
+If Sadida would manage to summon 6 dolls it would reduce damage taken by 46.8559% of initial damage.

Cons:
-If the doll would be aoe'd by enemy it would still die due to low health.
I will tell you why:
If the doll had even the same resistance as Sadida (wich i hope they will) and with even halved dmg received by aoe damage the doll would take 500 damage itself from the initial damage. Wich means if it would have less then 500 damage it would be KO'ed right away anyway regardless of the damage absorbed by the doll.

Conclusion: Dolls would need more HP anyway. My bet is 2x more then now (The Knowledge of Dolls could double doll's HP just like it double's Voodolls HP now - that would be easy to implement).

With my Sadida taken as example:
Curently i have 1622 HP.
The Greedy have now 17% of Sadida's max HP, wich means my Greedy have ~276 HP only.
If it were doubled it would reach ~551 HP.
This means that it would survive a hit from aoe that deal 1000 damage. However if it would be aoe'd togather with Sadida then it would be still KO'ed from Doll Link.

But let's assume i would use Blocker instead of Greedy for the Doll Link purpose.
Currently it have 32% of Sadida's max HP, wich means my Blocker have ~519 HP only. It may survive 1 hit from aoe that deal 1000 damage but barerly. It would be still KO'ed if it would be aoe'd by enemy togather with sadida.
Now if it were doubled it would become ~1038 HP (something i'd love to see again: Blocker with more then 1000 HP, ah i can dream...). This means the Blocker could actually survive the hit and the doll link redirection effectively. It would die on 2nd cast of such spell obviously but would at least give Sadida some protection needed.

Now the fact that doll would explode from that aoe might not be a bad thing afterall. If the Explodoll would have circle of 2 aoe instead of square of 1 (wich i hope it will), then Sadida might find itself within explosion range to get the heal from Explodoll. Obviously the lame amount of base 10 heal given by Grou in Explodoll is pathetic and wouldn't help for the loss of the doll but i also hope for Explodoll to deal more dmg/heal more HP.

But let's get back to the main topic. If the WP was removed from Doll cost then potentially (with lame equipement stats with useless fire element mostly) we would be able to summon 12 dolls. Well, yes, good luck summoning that many dolls with the high cost for each doll and with low survivalability for each. We won't need to summon more then 4 greedy dolls vs 1 enemy though as they wouldnt attack it anyway UNLESS we would get Voodoll summoned - then 8 greedy dolls +1 voodoll combo would be available (i wish it would be possible, seriosuly!). Still we might summon other dolls, right?

Ok i derailed it a bit again.

To the point then:

With 12 Dolls summoned (if doll link would redirect 10% of dmg per doll):
Sadida would take 282.429536481 damage (instead of 1000).
The dolls will take all the remaining damage to themself in the same way they did before. Not gonna make list of 12 dolls as it would be too long and anyone can calculate it for themself if they want to see those low numbers.

Summary:

Pros:
+Sadida with 12 dolls SOMEHOW summoned would be able to reduce damage taken by 71.7570463519%, wich is even closer to Sacrier's Coagulation 70% reduction comparing to the Doll Link before revamp (with 20% dmg reduction per doll).
+The dolls would not die that fast if Sadida would be hit by single target spells, comparing to the situation before revamp.

Cons:
-It would require Sadida to invest in gear with + Control for such protection, and those equipements themself doesn't provide much resistance/damage (but i suppose it would make things balanced actually).
-It would require Sadida to get 12 Dolls summoned to have something equal to what we had before the revamp with just 6 dolls (but then again i think thats also more balanced verison - nobody force us to get as much Control as Osamodas but having ability to get more then 6 dolls would be nice itself).


This post has been edited by Kikuihimonji - December 23, 2013, 22:40:42.
Reason for edit : changed comma's to period's
Ambitious Crackapult * Member Since 2011-12-03
posté December 23, 2013, 01:54:30 | #2
Using comma's instead of period's in your percentages is really confusing....

- Kat


Lord Madgobb * Member Since 2011-05-25
posté December 23, 2013, 19:55:22 | #3

Quote (kurokat @ 23 December 2013 01:54) *
Using comma's instead of period's in your percentages is really confusing....

- Kat
Thanks you are right. Fixed it.


Eccentric Moogrr * Member Since 2012-01-19
posté December 24, 2013, 02:28:08 | #4
I'm starting to wonder if you've ever played with a team. Nobody will want a sadida with 6-12 dumb dolls running around everywhere on the map, just so the sadida can maintain his survivability. Dolls should be unique with special supporting tasks, and what is currently killing the sadida is that dolls also can cause pure damage, which is crippling every other aspect of our class so our damage output doesn't get rediculously high. Damage dolls should be replaced so our spells are on par with every other class, and our doll should become team supportive ONLY. The "good old glory days" were us, summoning 5-6 dolls which blocked everyone and we still did less damage than everyone else. It was annoying, and we coudn't kill in any other way in teams. I actually like the new sadida alot more.
If you want to cause high damage with summons, then try osamodas which specialize in that. Dolls should be for support, and should only be summoned if you need them for some special task. Summoning up to 12 dolls, just for the heck of it, is chaotic and super bad for teams, and if we can't be effective otherwise then we'll keep on being useless. This isn't a solo game. Also remember that each doll has his own timer, and people want quick fights.


Quote
10% redirection of dmg is not gonna save anyone when enemy can hit you for 2000 dmg normally.
What? Do you have negative resistance? Who is hitting you for 2000 damage?

I'd rather have 10% damage reduction if my fragile dolls are unharmed, than 20% redirected to dolls. At least the redirection to Voodoll helps your cause.


Lord Madgobb * Member Since 2011-05-25
posté December 24, 2013, 23:52:53 | #5

Quote (GreenEmerald @ 24 December 2013 02:28) *
I'm starting to wonder if you've ever played with a team. Nobody will want a sadida with 6-12 dumb dolls running around everywhere on the map, just so the sadida can maintain his survivability. Dolls should be unique with special supporting tasks, and what is currently killing the sadida is that dolls also can cause pure damage, which is crippling every other aspect of our class so our damage output doesn't get rediculously high. Damage dolls should be replaced so our spells are on par with every other class, and our doll should become team supportive ONLY. The "good old glory days" were us, summoning 5-6 dolls which blocked everyone and we still did less damage than everyone else. It was annoying, and we coudn't kill in any other way in teams. I actually like the new sadida alot more.
If you want to cause high damage with summons, then try osamodas which specialize in that. Dolls should be for support, and should only be summoned if you need them for some special task. Summoning up to 12 dolls, just for the heck of it, is chaotic and super bad for teams, and if we can't be effective otherwise then we'll keep on being useless. This isn't a solo game. Also remember that each doll has his own timer, and people want quick fights.


Quote
10% redirection of dmg is not gonna save anyone when enemy can hit you for 2000 dmg normally.
What? Do you have negative resistance? Who is hitting you for 2000 damage?

I'd rather have 10% damage reduction if my fragile dolls are unharmed, than 20% redirected to dolls. At least the redirection to Voodoll helps your cause.
Just when did i say i want damaging dolls? I want dolls to be doing low damage. However the multiplied amount of dolls should give us as much dmg as osamodas summon thats just fair but the high cost of summoning dolls is not justified.

The osamodas have high base dmg togather with summons. Sadida have low base dmg spells that might be boosted by lone sadida but only without dolls and even then sadida deal less dmg and need more turns to "prepare the passive to give maxed effect" unlike the Rogue for example. So its ok for rogue to make multiple and not limited to WP bombs and deal aoe dmg in large zone while having high dmg itself but its not ok for sadida to have few dolls running about and attacking 1 target (each doll attack 1, while each bomb hit in aoe)? Then again its ok for Feca to be revamped to have unlimited with WP number of possible fire glyphs doing dmg in area (and with ability to even manually reposition it with fast cast of single water spell) but for dolls that deal less dmg and in more selective area with the troubles that each doll give to another (they each block each others way to reach enemy) its not ok? I mean feca can have high resist (permanently) from passive while other classes (Rogue or Enutrof, or Sacrier) can have permanent dmg right? And it can still make glyphs and armor (and you cant avoid getting hit by armor that hurt you every turn once its applied) while keeping its resist (feca) or making bombs and keeping dmg (rogue) activated all the time but its not ok for sadida to have the same thing even if it would require sadida to surivive for 5 turns to reach it? I mean: sadida is already is worse situation because it can't simply spam 1 strongest spell and deal high dmg from the very first turn (and dmg dealer classes like the mentioned rogue - can), because it will be not as strong as the same spell cast after 5th turn.

The reduction of AP, the heal or dmg - if its eqully good then i see no point to remove dmg dealing dolls. They act as your ranged dmg or redirection of your spells. For me it would suck if the only way to make dolls deal dmg for you would be related to sadida casting air spells on dolls for them to redirect it. I for once like dolls to deal water dmg too and i don't want to have another condition added to my gameplay that would require me to add poison every turn on dolls. Leave that to air sadida if you like it, but dont make water branch worse then it already is as its just pain comparing to air and you are simply asking to remove the only reason to play water sadida (other then heal that eni can do anyway, so why bothering with sadida to have it more complicated?). I mean the dolls that deal dmg - the ability to summon multiple little creatures that fight for you is in the Sadida concept: "it is too lazy" and therefore it "sends dolls to fight". If they would remove dmg from dolls then they would have to remove dmg from every other summon: including osamodas one and Sram's and Masq's double - but that would make those summons useless.

If you dont want 12 dolls or 12 control - dont aim for it. But why yours disliking it should block other people who liked that from getting it back? So lets say you dont like the way it was and you like it the way it is, and i will then say i like it more the way it was and i dont like it the way it is. A word vs a word. But unlike you i don't want to remove what sadida gained with revamp but instead allow sadida to also do what it did before: aka bring back the possible build that previous doll link was offering us.

Also you are misreading something. I am not asking for dolls to redirect 20% of dmg but 10%. I don't want to remove the mechanic from voodoll redirection either. And i also want to boost dolls HP. If you dont want redirection and just high in HP dolls, then dont level Doll Link. But if you want to tank while supporting allies (instead of spamming bamble shield on self to tank and not support allies while doing that) then Doll Link change is needed. My calculations shows that you will get nice protection already with 3 dolls and you might stop at that and play with just 3 dolls. Cheap cost of dolls would also let you resummon them if they die with less punishment to your dmg per turn.

And if you ask what deal 2000 dmg to me? Well it was just random high number but some classes like ecaflip does that dmg pretty often with All In doing double dmg. Rogue with STR build with piercing shots and crits also hit hard (if i am not earth sadida myself). Not to mention iops (fire) who can kill you by using bow or chasing you with their 6 or 7mp for the first few turns with jumping skills. Sadida will die before the lone sadida will build up unless it will have protection such as dolls taking part of dmg for it.

The change to doll link is also good if, for example, your blocker get left far away (got pushed and enemy runned too far). It might then be too far for you to sacrifice it but would still give you doll link protection so its not totally useless standing there. The doll link effect will eventually kill blocker for you, giving you free control that it was using while on the field.

The Grou wanted to introduce system where dolls are gradually loosing HP (sewing points aka charges). Now i dont think its good for the use of dolls to tank dmg/lock enemy/stay where they are. However it would be good in situation where you'd love to sacrifice that doll or turn it to different one as its usefulness got removed (example if hyperaction got too high and lethargic does not give you any profit anymore) but it runneed to far away for your reach or getting close enught ot reach it would make you close to enemy that you'd like to avoid. The Doll Link would give benefit for both mechanics. If you'd want to kill the old dolls that becae useless or cannot reach enemy fast, you'd hope for them to gradually loose HP - if you get hit it would cause them to do so. However you might want to use dolls to lock monsters while you hide behind some fecas or sacriers without making dolls loose HP while doing their job - simply avoid taking dmg then or shield yourself with bambly armor or maybe turn to Tree!

The dmg redirection won't kill doll right away if its not hit directly. It will also not die that fast if you dont suffer that much dmg as you claim you dont suffer yourself, so why you fear the change?

And don't say that nobody want 12 dolls running around everywhere on the map. Its like saying nobody want to have 2 high level summons as osamodas, wich is not true. I want my little army and i feel that dolls should give little things to sadida (each doll) - just like you say they should support sadida. But additional dmg is also support. Now why should i have only healing dolls that will add up heal resist eventually if for the pvp sake its better to focus on dmg? Heal make fight longer and dmg makes it faster. And you want to remove dmg from dolls? Thats totally awkard.

I might not aim for 12 dolls myself (because the gear that give much resist is basically fire element) but i would like to have 8 dolls and maybe voodoll too in the same time. Having maybe 2 blocker dolls, 1 madoll, 1 lethargic, 2 greedy, 1 ultrapowerful and 1 inflatable or other mix of dolls - this is something i would like to have (because that would give me something similar to osamodas summons: the combined lock from blockers, effect from madoll and UP as well as some more dmg from greedies and small healing effect added to it). I know it would make fight longer, wich is why you would simply had to use brain and not summon if its not necessary option. Even now with 4 control on me i am sometimes using only 2 dolls or no dolls at all even though i could be stubborn and aim to summon them all - it is sometimes not effective, but then again sometimes it is.

Following your logic they could just delete all dolls and make Sadida as another cra or "summon-less" rogue. I'd hate that and your suggestions to remove dmg dealing from dolls abilitites is leading to this. They even gave us ANOTHER dmg dealing doll - ultrapowerful, and now you want to remove it? What's wrong with you? No, seriously, i don't want to be rude but i am trying to make suggestion that will improve sadida gamplay while not denying current gameplay and you are totally against it for unknown reason. As if you just came here to argue that your style is different and you dont want another possible build to be given to Sadidas - the build that in fact got removed with revamp, aka something that made former Sadida players play it during beta days and for the first months of their p2p time. It was the thing that attracted me to play this class and it got vanished just like that. I refuse to play the class that i loved after the thing that i loved in it got removed. Simply: bring it back, with "nerfed" version (10% instead of 20% redirection per doll).

My calculations there were given to the likes of you to see that summoning next doll after certain point won't give sadida much change to the redirected dmg.

Yes it might take time to summon 12 dolls. Yes it might be annoying. But no, you are not forced to summon 12 of them, especially that in 1 vs 1 scenario only 4 greedy dolls can hit the same target (others will pass turn unless you will have ultrapowerful summoned before other greedy dolls that would cast gust spell to push previous greedies or unless there would be voodoll summoned, wich would allow you to have 4 more greedies attack the same enemy - something that Osamodas can do with 2 summons, easier, faster - but why making sadida completly unable to do something similar? Maybe lets remove healing from sadida too, because its too much time consuming to make few inflatables, where you could normally just spam heals as eniripsa and increase heal% with Hygienie instead? Seriously i think you just hate using dolls. I bet you've spend most of your team fight time as lone Sadida just to spam quick victories and level up fast. If you find that fun - ok! I am not trying to remove such gameplay. But i want to imporve dolls concept and give sadida realt supporting possiblity. I could instead suggest resist bonus to sadida per doll, but i feel that resist is Feca's stuff. The part of the dmg given to doll from Sadida is also one of the things that appeared in anime series (note: we got brambly shields BECAUSE of the anime where amalia can do it too). To be more specyfic, the amalia got poisoned in episode 7 (season 1) by demonic rose and the madoll of her felt the pain as well. If not for that link between sadida and this doll, Amalia would die instantly. Now the madoll doll is not a voodoll and the voodoll we make is linked to the target not to the sadida, wich makes it simply against the logic to work the way it is now.

Then again i don't want to remove this aspect of Sadida either, so i would just keep it while bringing back the ability of Sadida to redirect dmg to dolls summoned. Summoner gamplay lack of that passive, wich makes it not that effective as simple spam of spells as lone Sadida. Then again you may choose to not summon dolls as i said but suddenly your team might require another tank in their team while not removing your ability to shield one of the ally - this is where doll link would come handy - save the team - even if that makes the fight longer - do you think its bad idea? I used to summon blocker dolls to keep monsters busy but when i saw that eniripsa could not keep up with healing up the tank and other team members were fragile with their damaging and not defensive builds (glass cannons) i had to take an action and i rushed to the front line (to the middle of monsters to be more precise) used pushed spells to make them close to me, positoned dolls so that enemy would pass though my lock zone instead of allies and that made me able to tank thanks to the doll link - it gave eniripsa enough time to heal up the injured allies and allowed allies to regroup (reposition) while i kept monsters busy with my own body and with dolls bodies. It was beautiful supporting for my team and they loved me for that. And so i want that ability again.

Did i mentioned that summoning 12th doll for the protection sake is close to pointless as you get enough protection with 3rd doll already? You shouldn't fear then as you might not even need to use control gear if you will think that 3 dolls is enough. As for dolls survivalability - do note i want them to have 2x more HP. I think you missed that point. Those changes would overall imporve Sadida without giving it nerfs as Ankama used to do with every revamp.


Eccentric Moogrr * Member Since 2012-01-19
posté December 25, 2013, 03:34:24 | #6
You seem to focus a lot on pvp. I ask how you think that this amount of dolls will affect team play, which is what this game is really about. The greedy dolls offer nothing but pure damage, which is something that they're not even good at. The more dolls you summon, the more you'll block every team mate and actually lower overall team damage, and most greedys will actually die from friendly aoe fire because other team mates can't hit their opponents without killing dolls.
The sadida was never meant to be a high damaging class. There are alot of other classes which do alot more damage. Still, we get a penalty for summoning now because our boosted damage combined with an army of damaging dolls would give a too high damage output. But do we really NEED damaging dolls? Wouldn't people be happier with increased spell damage and 6 team friendly dolls instead? It would further increase our supportive role, which is what our class is really all about. All of our 3 elemental branches can support a team.

No, I don't hate using dolls, but I'm forced to not use them simply because I get too crippled with dolls. And you'll quickly realize that teams don't want dolls for end-game (except for rare occasions like BC or Hagen). They want you for your supportive spells. Any doll is crippling to your support. Yet, they have so much potential.
I personally think that the worst of them all is Greedy. Try attacking anything in wabbit island with Greedys, which involves annoying tactics like attacking from back/front only, or not stepping in Wabbit glyphs. Now imagine that you have 3-12 dolls out doing absolutely nothing but prolong the fights, and you just sit there and hope that they're stupid enough to focus you so you can finally benefit from your passives... It's nice that you want damaging dolls for pvp, but I'm pretty sure that most sadidas didn't think "pvp" when they picked the class. The Ultra-Powerful isn't needed for the damage either, just for the states that it applies. So why not just replace them with something we actually need, and not cripple us for using dolls since they now won't do damage anyway? You would not NEED many dolls this way, just enough to help you or your team overcome specific obstacles.

Also, please keep your post shorter. Your last reply equals to 3 MsWord pages...


Lord Madgobb * Member Since 2011-05-25
posté December 25, 2013, 10:31:10 | #7
If you dont want to use dmg dealing dolls - dont use them. Simple as that. But don't make those who want to use them unable to do so by deleting them. I actually like the greedy dolls to deal dmg for me. They are like spread aoe if i send them to different directions and unlike blockers they do some dmg and has more MP to reach certain enemy. Inflatables are also useful and they are not moving to enemy lock zone. We also have voodoll to be summoned so that allies can safetly aim for voodoll without getting hurt by the actuall enemy that the dolls are covering.

You see sadida have tools to use many dolls and still be team friendly. I remember the days when nettle was giving some AP to dolls and rust was also giving 3AP to dolls targeted instead of dmg. It was really awsome watching 4 greedies doing their "cat fight" madness when nettled. My team mates were also enjoying it and nobody wanted me to kill dolls as they were doing then decent dmg for me. They were more like osamodas summon - do people want osamodas to not summon? No, they want him to do so. Why? Because it deal decent dmg. So how about if that osamodas summon would have ability to split its own body and instead of relying on lock and blocking dangerous enemy from only 1 side to block enemy from 4 sides? Thats what dolls can do and i know people who are happy for that. now if i would just use blockers then that would feel like really long fight. However the fact that greedies do dmg (each of them) means that they are decreasing enemy HP and 4 greedies togather do it nicely.

The issue is only HP and resist of these dolls - they need higher survivalability to make good use of team. What people hate is that if i summon something that will die right away, wich indeed is annoying. If the dolls would last longer then people would be more like: "ok cool that 1 monster will die from dolls eventually lets focus on other enemy while Sadida saved us some time that we would need to heal up".

So what we really need is opposite to what you are saying.

And different dolls are for different usage. I might not use greedies in wabbit place, but then again i might use it in whisperer island. I won't use them in frigost for obvious reason, but then i will use ultrapowerfuls or inflatables, sacrificials, etc.

And again you are not forced to get 12 control, just like osamodas isn't.

The issue is controling dolls too or their AI - those things need to be fixed/solved. I would hate i they would delete dmg dealing dolls. If i can't reach ally to heal it directly - i send inflatable there; if enemy can be stopped from attacking ally if it loose that 1 mp but i can't reach it with bramble directly due to los - i send madoll there; if enemy is almost dead but its my turn and if i don't finish it it would kill ally (or do other mess) - i am sending dolls to kill it.

We can all say that greedies are doing to low dmg - but that need improvement not nerf.

Sadida itself doesnt need to deal high dmg (maybe except sadida's tear spell who is meant to do that). But the sadida was never meant to be weaker then dmg dealers either. No! You got it all wrong. The dolls that deal dmg are there to made up for the lower base dmg on sadida spells. They are your additional source of dmg. They require investment (some AP lost first turn when you summon them) but then if they survive longer they will made up for that loss. The thing is that they are not surviving that long enough and that people are used to beacons that are normally 1 time use of dmg boost. Dolls are not like that. The ones who think that each doll should deal high dmg and die are also killing the concept of dolls, while there might be one doll like that (sacrificial) other dolls are used in different way, and making them die easily from their low HP and low resistance is the bad design that Ankama should fix.

EDIT:

There is also a concept to make doll not block LoS for allies and to give allies +1MP when they come to doll's lock zone (to allow allies to move around doll without loosing much MP) or ally could step on doll to jump over it (but thats more difficult to implement). That would make dolls ally-friendly for both ranged and melee allies. There are plenty of posibilities to make dolls more welcome. Still you won't use them at certain situation such as in Milkar the Moowolf fight where they would turn to enemy side. Or simply when you won't see the need to summon them. The point is that concept to summon multiple dolls should be improved not negated nor nerfed.