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Christian-CAO's profile
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Member Since : 2012-01-12
541 Posts (0.49 per day)
Most active in : General Discussion
posté March 04, 2015, 03:04:59 | #1

Quote (Heartyace @ 04 March 2015 02:54) *

Quote (MiniMikeh @ 04 March 2015 02:44) *

Quote (ennieeee @ 04 March 2015 02:33) *
"at least one should automatically be AP" that sounds like less freedom to me o.o

I mean I don't know, the fact that we have relics/epics (a) with exotic AP, (b) without exotic AP, (c) with 2 AP, (c) with 2 MP... that does give you quite a number of build choices. You're right in that players naturally gravitate towards wanting more AP, but that doesn't change the fact that there are viable builds that aren't 12 AP/6 MP, and gear to support this variety, so players are at liberty to experiment with alternative builds.

Not that it wouldn't be nice to automatically get AP and MP without spending any points, but I'm not really sure how that changes anything xD Either we'll all just end up investing the points in the same things (final damage/range), or 13 AP will become a thing... so essentially the same as now, except everyone starts with more base AP.

Quote (Green-Stripe @ 04 March 2015 02:27) *
What if I have my own personal build and I want to not stat AP and go MP, Range, and final damage instead? If you force people to stat AP it doesn't feel like freedom at all.

You guys aren't understanding it completely. He means giving a free AP on top of the major point.

Kinda like how dofus gives you a free ap at level 100
I think only the AP should be mandatory, that suggestion isn't bad. But MP isn't necessary. But things like WP, kit skill and Control are pretty weak right now.
kit skill wouldn't be so weak if they'd remove that worthless 10 kitskill cap and integrate kitskill back into gear in a fair and plausible way.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #835411  Replies : 27  Views : 761
posté March 03, 2015, 07:18:31 | #2

Quote (Oanhanhon @ 03 March 2015 06:35) *

Quote (AnonymousXeroxGuy @ 02 March 2015 21:39) *
I like the Dofus 1.0 style




Forever A Bauss.
I miss the sleepy eyes, the wild hair and the bandages not covering the head totally, I really don't like the look of Xelors in Dofus nowadays.

That thing is a Xelor!?....

Anyway, Dofus hurts my eyes (spoiled by wakfu's beautiful visuals, yeah dofus has back grounds but those glorified backdrops they call maps are mostly static, so no, wakfu's world has more "life" to it) so I'd have to just pick wakfu graphically, however conceptually certain dofus design choices are better by far albeit a bit lack luster style. If it wasn't for the easy nature of templates, wakfu wold win hands down but they chose bland templates for everything other than Foggers. The price of sleek quick and efficient design in wakfu's case was the loss of "personality" in the characters. They are pretty lifeless in wakfu....we need more faces and hairstyles honestly...


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #835156  Replies : 36  Views : 1068
posté February 26, 2015, 17:00:02 | #3
Only problem I have with lock and dodge system is that certain monsters have skills to blow away more than half your mp every turn and they also have insane lock...

Though it's my osamodas who has the problem with it....low level problems~ wobots make me sad when their speed bonus kicks in. It's my own fault for not going into a dragon spec... also, it's my fault for fighting alone rather than having a battle buddy.

anyway, if every combat map was polter in elmeka big, It would be nice. Currently combat maps are just too small to justify a game where 7 mp can get you more than half way across the map most of the time.

I should play a close combat character to see the flip side to this... but most have tools to get close to you and then keep you near them forever. I mean once both players have gotten into a certain position on the map, that's it. Close combat fighter usually can hit their target without worrying about using any skills to get into their ideal range. The game of tag usually ends unless one target can slip away behind another and cheese their way out farther with other abilities and spells (sram and pandawa)... but in a team battle... everything changes dramatically.

Too many factors and bias opinion for every situation but the lock and dodge system is waaay~ more fair then it used to be.

It's decent as is. no more luck in the mix.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #833920  Replies : 75  Views : 2159
posté February 11, 2015, 04:56:26 | #4

Quote
Useless weapons crafts. (and how to fix them)

An age old question!

How about we break the mold by answering with an old Chinese proverb?

  • "Two Tiger lilies Try to Take Turns Twisting in TheMAKE CRAFTED WEAPONS NOT USLESS"







...No really. It's a Proverb. Google it.

I mean... why the hell wouldn't there just be better stats on crafted items? Always. ALL Ways! Put the little golden hammer symbol on anything crafted over anything...not... crafted... (?) (forget imperfect crafts/that crap makes no sense)

Make it possible to craft any and all gear in the game. An idea they had and have still not followed through with yet because time is always an enemy and will never be your friend. Ever.

Make the difference in the crafted weapon/armor/ whatever around 12% more damage. 12%. Not 5. Not 10. 12%. Twelve Percent. Maybe more!? But we don't want to seem greedy!. 12 is perfect! It's just the right amount of difference some one might care enough to bother crafting a weapon that they'll more than likely drop if it's an option.

Make two crafting recipes.
  1. Regular one to net that 12% ALL damage/ whatever the star stat is on the particular piece of equipment
  2. A simplified version that uses the dropped version of a weapon/any gear as an ingredient in the formula along with some simple tempering ores and blah blah blah! This way, even if you'd rather just drop the item all together, there would be no reason not to just craft it by dropping the weapon first then tempering the tool to make it into the stronger version. However The normal recipe should yields Waaaaaay more experience for leveling the profession.
Clearly there is a gas leak somewhere in my home but bare with me!

Make! The drop rates! .....lower on gear that is looted... now before you kill me! Remember. I am a human too. I like being alive and so do you....most of you anyway.... now would you want to be killed in the rallying overzealous flames of an organized hate parade? Or do you like chilling out maxing relaxing all cool? I prefer the later...

Making drop rates lower on the actual gear on the loot table while raising the materials gained and a higher drop rate all together of those said materials will make crafting weapons and gear in general more desirable since it's kind of pigeonholing players interests. Kind of counter intuitive since this game is loaded with OPTIONS and [optional content]. This would kind of make people feel as if they Have to level crafting in order to "play the game".

Not true, not true. Okay Friend!? Higher someone to do it for you.

Sellers, don't be a douche.
If a player can gather the materials for their craft then ask for a small (small)(smaller) (the smaaaalllst you can think of) payment for your time. If you have to gather materials for anything for your clients though... it's free reign.

It's not perfect. Nothing is. Look at this game that we love so dear!! It's an idea~ good? Good!
Bravo! oh Bravo!! Applause, applause. Nod and agree. I thank you.

Discussion time, yes?


This post has been edited by Christian-CAO - February 11, 2015, 05:00:07.
Reason for edit : For MAXIMUM!! Effect. Please Be reading in Moroccan Accent. I Thank you.
Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #829282  Replies : 25  Views : 879
posté February 08, 2015, 04:13:53 | #5
...fated to close.. though it would be interesting to receive mount based combat whilst on a mount... a form of battle much like human cavalry battle or jousting thing. a little mini game based combat of trying to knock the other guy off their mount. A whole different type of battle map generator ... I'll stop myself here... where was I going with this?

Giving players mount battle mechanics to use is an interesting idea but forget everything about class abilities and spells.

Make the mount an alternate active option that you can toggle to from your weapons. You should be able to call your mount into the battle and It should cost you next to nothing to do this so it should be for a low 1 ap cost.

... however mounts should share 45% of a players HP and 75% of a players resists 6 Ap, 2mp, 4 wp and 100% of a players dodge +50

The player can click the mount active option again once the mount is "summoned" to see a small window open up much like an osamodas summon bar. On that window should be a two actives:
  1. Mount- A 1 mp costing spell that allows a player to ride a mount. You'll have to be next to the mount to even cast it. Once on a mount the player has new spells and passives available to them...or rather the mounts spells/actives and passives. While mounted the mount will take 50% of the damage the rider receives. The rider still takes 100% of the damages of course.
  2. 'Go on and Git'- this is a free cast that returns an ap to the player once used. you basically tell your mount to take a hike and skedaddle. The mount will leave the battlefield. The mount cannot be called back into the battle for 5 turns.
Once a player gets on their 'Mount' you can only see the mounts spells/ active skills and passives. Also you can see your weapon.

Passives:
  • M[Power]- The mount always has 2 more mp then the player riding it. For example; Spending all your mp to get to your mount and getting on it will give the mount 2 mp for that turn. However the next turn you can expect to have your full mp at your disposal +2 so long as you are on your mount.
  • Spooked- While on a mount it is impossible to lock a target. The mount has a 40% chance of moving back 2 cells when damaged. There is also a 20% chance that the mount will run away from the battle once hit. Dismounting the rider.
  • Mounted combat- weapon attacks get 10% (100% max) ranged/closecombat/ aoe damage bonuses each time you spend an mp. This plays off the fact that you are indeed mobile and should use the added momentum to your advantage.
  • `Chilling out maxing relaxing all cool'- For each turn While 'idle' (not mounted), The mount heals 10% of its max HP and has an 80% chance of gaining 1 wp. There is a 45% chance that the mount will fall asleep and be unable to interact with a player while 'idle'(not mounted).
Actives:
  • Haste- This costs 1 wp. The Mount gains 3 mp and increases Hypermovement by 30% The mount cannot be locked this turn. It has a 2 turn cooldown
  • Leap- This costs 3 ap + 2 mp. The Mount jumps and lands on the designated cell. It has no line of sight and can let the mount jump up to 4 cells in any direction. The mount has a 30% chance of gaining 'lead legs'. This has a 2 uses per turn limit
  • Daunt- This costs 2 ap. The mount forces a target to move back 3 cells. The mount becomes stabilized after use. This active has a 1 cast per target limit
  • Charge- This costs 4ap+ 1 wp + the mounts remaining MP. This moves the Mount to as many cells from its starting point (old bliss'krieg animation please and thank you) to it's designated cell (equal to the mp used up to cast this spell). The mount deals 100% of a players level and 90% of the players highest mastery as damage. (example: a lvl 100 player with 325 in earth mastery as their highest damage lets the charge attack deal 100 base damage and gives the mount 292-293 earth mastery) It has a 40% chance of 'stunning' every target caught in the aoe (a straight line) making each target loose 3 ap, 2 mp and become 'confused'. This spell has a 3 turn cooldown. The mount gains the 'tired' state and can only use 1/2 of its mp rounded down for 1 turn. (obviously a silly attack...maybe only 75% of a players level for the damage....)
Disengaging your mount will bring you back to your normal character stuff as usual.

Honestly I don't expect this to ever be a thing...but to expect normal class spells and passives to look 'right' is silly, so it's best to just get rid of them and force players who want to use a mount in combat to treat it as an inconvenient form of effective movement. An awkward and time consuming utility to move ever so much farther than you normally would be able to do, in combat and dismount when you've gotten to an area of your liking.

Freely able to jump back on your mount while it is still idle lets you do whatever you want to do in a turn but it still eats up tons of time with animations and least not forget that the mount while idle blocks line of sight. I refuse to let it have any form of ai...however with the chances of a mount up and leaving the battlefield after being hit or just falling asleep...it makes this little mechanic cumbersome and unnecessarily complicated...just the way I'd want it.

It's not everyones cup of tea but being able to freely move around an extra 4 cells seems worth spending the 1 ap to call in something that may just fall asleep sometimes if you aren't on it. It can block line of sight so maybe giving it similar ai to that terrible voodoll that sadidas have and make it runaway most times or maybe make it follow its master more often than not, so it doesn't potentially help box something in. It should be noted that the 'idle' mount only has 2 mp to work with so maybe letting it have a simple ai is fine. Since players can spend 1 mp to mount the thing and control its every move.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #828321  Replies : 27  Views : 872
posté February 07, 2015, 10:05:13 | #6

Quote (Madd1 @ 07 February 2015 06:42) *

Quote (Christian-CAO @ 07 February 2015 04:52) *
wait I don't get it, ALT+F4 makes you log out immediately?

neat.

Avoiding a pvp battle should be in everyones interests, especially if you know you can't win the fight. Hit and run is a perfectly viable thing to do.

This ganking Pking silly excuse of a player versus player combat game where just straight up mindlessly tackling anything that has Obnoxious wing banners on its head is not built on the idea of "fair play". Any instance where you can just select a target for the hell of it, kill them and be rewarded for it is just silly. The god Sram must be giving out this "Merit" or something, I swear...

No one wants to loose a fight, so the strategic withdrawal just seems sensible.

Though, It's understood that with all these timer based mechanics involved in common teleportation and logging out means the developers don't want us running away to save merit. So I can see why the ALT+F4 thing contradicts the current pvp's design (as flawed as it is)

So yeah... fix it since it really isn't intentional for people to currently bail out of messy situations in this sloppy pvp system.
I don't know what server you play on, but Nox has a _HUGE_ problem with the fact that the merit economy is literally DEAD. Damn near NOBODY is willing to PVP if they aren't 95% sure they will win. This leads to a very low-income Merit environment, where every merit point becomes absolutely PRECIOUS to some people and they are willing to start any and every possible drama, use every dirty tactic, and just generally be poor humans/players all over the server just to scratch they're way the slightest bit ahead in merit.

This is a terrible system and leads to absolutely awful and dirty play in the current PVP meta. Reasons like this are why I don't think you should give players more options to literally just avoid combat and covet their merit. Fights should be easier to get into and out of, merit should be more readily available, harder to lose and see significant gains from team fights vs solo fights.

That's my opinion.

Peace,
Madd
I pretty much agreed with you even in my post... despite the flavor of my text where I am for people just up and avoiding combat because, as you said, it's hard to come by so when people get merit they'd like to be able to keep it and maybe build up some if they are legitimate about it but as you also say people do plenty of lowbrow things to obtain merit especially in Nox. No one wants to lose anything. However in a ranked pvp system someone has to be the loser and the other a winner. Can't have one without the other...and there's nothing gained from a loss in this game other than the bitter taste of defeat and the battle experience...

any way, I did say that they should fix this since they don't want people to bail out of messy situations as it is. This is no different from being able to use your almanax temple teleporter instantaneously. They don't want that. So they shouldn't let the Alt+F4 loophole be allowed.

So yeah, I agree with you and stuff....Nox server as well by the way... I'm an uber casual so it's plain to see you wouldn't know me....seen you though.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #828069  Replies : 35  Views : 1389
posté February 07, 2015, 04:52:28 | #7
wait I don't get it, ALT+F4 makes you log out immediately?

neat.

Avoiding a pvp battle should be in everyones interests, especially if you know you can't win the fight. Hit and run is a perfectly viable thing to do.

This ganking Pking silly excuse of a player versus player combat game where just straight up mindlessly tackling anything that has Obnoxious wing banners on its head is not built on the idea of "fair play". Any instance where you can just select a target for the hell of it, kill them and be rewarded for it is just silly. The god Sram must be giving out this "Merit" or something, I swear...

No one wants to loose a fight, so the strategic withdrawal just seems sensible.

Though, It's understood that with all these timer based mechanics involved in common teleportation and logging out means the developers don't want us running away to save merit. So I can see why the ALT+F4 thing contradicts the current pvp's design (as flawed as it is)

So yeah... fix it since it really isn't intentional for people to currently bail out of messy situations in this sloppy pvp system.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #828031  Replies : 35  Views : 1389
posté February 02, 2015, 09:22:16 | #8
I'm confused, why does the barrel have hp if nothing tries to attack it except maybe a player? Kiku's suggestion of making it a summon that passes its turn like a faulty sadida doll (all the dolls) is pretty good if all that is going on is monsters ignore the barrel...


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #826357  Replies : 81  Views : 2261
posté January 22, 2015, 18:46:31 | #9

Quote (Heartyace @ 22 January 2015 10:12) *
Edit: I agree with Mini. Sugnuf/Cactus was the beginning of annoying dungeon designs instead of fun ones.

Does no one remember the beginning of Strich Dungeon?

(granted once you understood what you needed to actually win in a single room you were golden, however it's not posted outside the dungeon so you had to find out the hard way. So if you didn't have an archtype to fit the locking role in your first run then you lost.... took 2 hours in my groups first run of stritch dungeon just to clear the first TWO rooms...yeah we sucked, but damn two hours. I don't know if they won, I had to leave for work damnit.) 


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #822862  Replies : 23  Views : 1169
posté January 22, 2015, 18:29:06 | #10
My titles are varied but my osa has the most since they just toss titles at you for nearly everything in the game~

But each of my toons has a fitting title or an endearing title with a purpose behind it based on circumstance or experience or role-play feature.

Osa- "Pioneer" because he is my first character ever

Enutrof- "Ancestral Elder" for obvious reasons

Pandawa- "incessant Fighter of Nano-Dangers" When my panda was around level 60-70ish and the old fogger event occurred he solo'd the entire event and beat Sir Flexington all by him self using that good old fashioned Panda-Jank. It took forever since he was weak as hell but he still won even though Sir Flexington usually remains out of his range forcing a situation where the barrel would be destroyed every now and then and blah blah blah rambling, everyone in the Black black club back then told him to just give up and that he wasn't strong enough or high enough to bother soloing the place and should ask for help from some of them but he kept at it and finally won on the last day of the events availability.

Sadida- "Master of Flowers" For obvious reasons but also because of my own personal theme for my character since his name means Heavenly rebirth Flower in Hawaiian or at least it would if Ankama would remove the silly rules of not allowing too many spaces between a certain amount of letters in the damn character creation options. Well anyway, back when sadidas could die and turn into the ultra powerful I knew it was a stupid and near worthless mechanic at the time but it was funny to me. Also I just spent the battle running around screaming "I AM A FLOOOOOOWErrrrrRRR!!!" Relevant because I role-play with all my characters and my sadida used to be brooding and deep (emo) and just always sullenly told people he wishes he was born a flower...

Foggernaut- "Survivor" It would have been Stalwart Fogger but I decided in the middle of his life to delete him and start all over again once the new Incarnum came out along with that incarnate "class" and the new tutorials the first time they changed it up. Time and time again I used to consider just deleting my foggernaut since the way I wanted to play him was too complicated and impractical in the early levels and back then the gear and stats just weren't up to snuff...also I don't powerlevel so there's that option down the drain. I also am a role-play fanatic and just couldn't find a purpose in my foggers story or "character" He was just there to be there it seemed. However, once I pondered it enough on wondering what's the point of his existence and if having some robot was worth it, it came to me then. Do robots "FEEL"? Do they think?.... and if so, are they their own thoughts or are they thoughts programmed into them called A.I? With those in mind I now have my foggernaut talking like a robot and using HTTP code speech along with options to ease it like his [FFCCP] free form casual conversation protocol- which is speech without the use of code or robotesque notions for "5" sentences. Whenever he hits five sentences he must then re-initiate the [FFCCP]. However recently that got annoying so he now has the [AFFCCP] Advanced free form casual conversation protocol- which is the same program but it doesn't have the five sentence limit.


There we go.... looking back all of that was really unnecessary for such a simple question....  


This post has been edited by Christian-CAO - January 22, 2015, 18:35:06.
Reason for edit : ....
Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #822860  Replies : 50  Views : 1710
posté January 08, 2015, 01:42:11 | #11

Quote (Hudski @ 08 January 2015 01:31) *
It was useless and irritating. [Oh~(just like real world diseases, though others may argue that it serves as populatin control...I think we already do a pretty good job of wiping each other off the face of the existence)- that was me~] If you were grinding gobbs to level up they'd specifically give you a disease that made you drop everything to go find a cure, and that's only if you got it the legit way - People could attack you to give you whatever the hell disease they wanted to give you and you'd have no say in the matter.

There's a reason why there's no diseases in the current build, and it's because everybody literally hated them. They ran a poll on the Wakfu page to see if people actually liked diseases and wanted to see them expanded upon or removed and the result was the entire community saying to get rid of them so that's what they did.

Wonder why everyone is so supportive of removing content rather than improving a feature?

I'm sure with the right premise it could have been something worth implementing...

I mean, who likes being hit with negative ailments? That's right, no body. No one in their right mind would ever say they like being inflicted with penalties and stat reductions.... so of course that poll went exactly how anyone would have thought it did.

I mean yeah I'm sure there were some supporters but those weirdos probably only wanted it there because it had a "unique" impact on the game experience as players had to deal with the possibility of incurring some pestilent disease...

My god, we need something like that in game... However it needs to be changed into something worth while... (?) how can being sick be worth while?.....

With that though, I've never been a part of that version of wakfu.

I love all those options, they look fantastic..haven bags....what the hell happened to their creativity?

Only thing I don't agree with as some of you have stated is the graphics... I mean, environment wise it's beautiful! However, I'm not a fan of the big head little body character sprites back then and much rather prefer the current models.

Other than that though, everything else just looked so much more together...maybe that's why they altered it since the world just seemed too together...though I am sure those pictures don't serve the old version justice. It looked like an experience I regret not being a part of.


This post has been edited by Christian-CAO - January 08, 2015, 01:49:47.
Reason for edit : moar~
Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #818284  Replies : 52  Views : 2282
posté January 08, 2015, 01:29:27 | #12
Easy, there, no need for hostilities. rmw1 is entitled to his opinion.


Quote (rmw1 @ 07 January 2015 21:50) *
No.
why?
Because this is a PvE game.
Move along.


Anyway, while the game is indeed currently 80% PvE and 20% PvP (thanks to the pvp system they implemented subjugating players to kill one another for shining balls of light and nation versus nation being useless currently) its selling point in the past was the huge options available to the players. Nation wars are still something to consider despite it's current state, in the past you could at least role play into an event or something or a past based petty argument turning into a full game shaking war for casuals discomfort. The ability to protect what is yours by attacking people who have disturbed you. Attacking people just for the sake of attacking them and nothing more, or even to create chaos in a usually calm peaceful environment. Now we have the option to attack one another to obtain superficial but other wise really nice gear and costumes at the sacrifice of not being able to fight when ever we want; where ever we want and are forced to wear targets called wing on your head if you wish to kill some one for any reason, not just merit (but why do that with no gain other than to be a villainous wretch).

The game has always had pvp in mind from its creation. Players interacting with one another in many different ways is what makes mmo's different from any other game out there. If I wanted to play an rpg with a set story and a set goal and only have to fight enemies that the game is designed to have, then I'd just go out and buy/ play Final Fantasy Tactics again or dust off my old playstation and play some grandia1 or Lunar.

What makes games like this great are the people you meet in it.... for better or for worse, having multiple ways to interact with one another is what made this game perfect...for me.

Trading, crafting, selling, leveling, and fighting against/ alongside one another are what make up the social aspects of the game. You can choose to play alone and then it does become just a PvE game, but playing with others is ten times more fun.

I'd just like for the player versus player combat to become something like the game within the game.

Multiple layers and categories of player versus player combat...

When wars come into the picture again and politics get deeper along side the nation revamps and guild versus guild... couple these with a basic anything goes pk system with no rewards and a few safe zones and slap a structured pvp option along side it for sanctioned battles and an arena to hold more prestigious combat for rewards and other glorious prizes to make it worth while and I'd be in love with pvp again.

One thing... I am not "for" harassment but I do not wish for game mechanics to police players. Let players handle the situation on their own. I'd rather there be an experience and something to be gained/ lost from conflict, rather than not allowing conflict to ever be an option to be experienced. Give the players the option to settle those situations themselves till the extreme happens and a moderator must be flagged in...

Yes, there are allot of unfortunate situations that have happened and continue to happen. Bullying and the like, and the old system had done nothing but nurture that kind of an environment where if someone could be a bully then they could be that bully. However it's not the fault of the system but the players involved.

Yes, I hate it when my friends all drop off one after another from the game due to being attacked too often... but at the same time there are better ways of handling things rather than walking off upset never to return again...

anyway, yes, there are victims in that kind of system, but I feel like I'd much rather have those options and chances of things like that happening rather than not have them at all.... who the hell am I replying to? Why bring this up?

well anyway, to summarize that...self induced nonsensical self righteous marmalade .... bad things may be bad but they too are a part of this experience called wakfu. I wouldn't want to have it any other way.


This post has been edited by Christian-CAO - January 08, 2015, 01:32:28.
Reason for edit : added quote for reply confusion relay~
Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #818280  Replies : 37  Views : 1525
posté January 07, 2015, 01:14:05 | #13

Quote (Mox-Jackal @ 06 January 2015 21:37) *

Quote (Christian-CAO @ 06 January 2015 04:57) *

Quote (zoombas @ 05 January 2015 18:04) *
Would be cool if a player gets attacked (in PvP) there could be a guild interface tab that would allow players to teleport to their guild member from anywhere in the world, to help back them up if they needed. (system similar to joining preceptor fights in dofus)

IMO this would bring an interesting roll to Guilds in regards to GvG and PvP in general.

Might consolidate some guilds too to form strong alliances.

It'd be great if that silly call for help button actually did what it sounds like it would do

I like the idea, it'd be really nice to have the option to jump into fights while they are still going on, too... however there needs to be a limit or certain instances where you can't do it...like in an official pvp match. Outside of a prestigious battle, anything can go...


Quote
heres a cure to pvp one remove it because its killing the game or split all spells into pve and pvp versions alotting them to balance and fix pve and nerf to death everything for pvp players as pvp has killed wakfu and made every class pointlessly weak in pve

Drat, you're alive~

Still as pessimistic as ever I see, eh?

Great to see you, but I gotta say I don't really agree with you on your opinion. I mean, there are always those moments where someone is killing people who don't want to be involved in that type of combat, and I understand it can be really frustrating...

However, the point of this thread isn't so much how to cure the Current pvp system that we have... but rather what you or I or anyone would like to see in a player versus players system. Ideas and thoughts on your own ideal system of how pvp "should" be to you. It's all opinions and I'd be more than happy to hear your take on what a good pvp system should be or how things could be, ideally
xO FWEY FWEY!!! of course iam alive
not tottally pessimistic but i do look like it though, optimistic is more like it both i prefer both
iam tired of them killing wakfu based on pvp, the one issue they need to fix is the opt out option
If you opt out you should not be able to be attacked, if you opt in then you can attack and be attacked, simple
Need to bring everyone back to the world, even frey =p


Quote (Madd1 @ 06 January 2015 05:35) *

Quote (Mox-Jackal @ 05 January 2015 21:20) *
alotting them to balance and fix pve
and nerf to death everything for pvp players
as pvp has killed wakfu and made every class pointlessly weak in pve
Uh... I've never felt stronger in PVE than I do now that I've nearly finished PVP setups... How on earth can you complain that chars are 'too weak in PVE' when there's tons of people out there still complaining the game is too easy?

I honestly think the devs are doing their best to find happy mediums and they've taken leaps and bounds in the right direction. The game will flow and change, you can flow with it or join the long list who have left. None of us really have much of a choice in that.

-Madd
etc
I see you, and I understand.

However my ideal system is somewhat more or less on a take of a free for all battle system where anyone can be attacked at any time. However you can only gain prizes and ranks and prestige/ merit by fighting in true Consent battles. True pvp is organized in my ideal system. However there should still be the option of attacking players without a gain and just to be jerk.

I know you hate that half and many do as it has "ruined" their in game experience and has actually made a lot of our own freinds quit in the past. Not only that but player versus player combat being a driving force for allot of the nerfs to classes abilities in the past is a pressing concern, so I get where you are coming from.

Looking away from the balancing of classes abilities and spells though, I am in favor of a system where people can be attacked at any given moment in most areas of the game but also wish for there to be structured fighting going on with great rewards to encourage more of that kind of player versus player interaction. Both are awesome in their own ways honestly.

Nothing feels more alive than a world where you can do almost anything and the wakfu of old most certainly had that going for it. Slapping high powered items into the game and making everyone extra powerful at base by stats won't help gear the game back on course to the vast boundless sandbox that it was building up to be. Not to say that those things are bad but what ever happened to strategy?

Also Drat, please try to not pick fights by name calling and stay on topic. I know you can get a bit into it, but you need to not resort to that kind of thing when voicing your opinions. Madd has his and you have yours.

The matters revolving pvp ruining our characters because the developers went a little balance (nerf) crazy and around those shields though... I should tell you that they were pretty broken. Do I miss them? Hell yes! No one can say other wise. I loved not taking damage and avoiding racking up heal resists as a gobgob osa and sadida. However from a balance stand point, pve and pvp wise, it's not fair. Yes it's true that monsters get all sorts of nice tools and free mechanics to create some artificial difficulty so it was nice when we had similar tactics to resort to and rely on but honestly we didn't and don't need to be invulnerable to damage.

While it's nice to have nice things... no one "needs" nice things. It's fine to want things but what do we really need?

An experience! An epic moment where you are proud to have achieved victory or whatever it was that you accomplished. Interaction with this game as it has progressed and "matured" I've watched things go a bit backwards. The moment Ultimate bosses stopped roaming areas and the moment the quests were taken out of the equation to interact with them was the moment that things started to go south direction wise for the game...at least for me. It's not that ultimate bosses needed to be roaming bosses, they don't really have to honestly, but why rip roaming bosses form the game entirely? It was nice to run into the Wild gobball king/ queen in those old days. We can have big bosses in dungeon instances like UB's and still could have had a roaming boss or three walking around every now and th... OFF TOPIC soooo~ off topic way out in left field let me stop myself now~

Anyway, keep it cool. Respect others opinions and they'll respect yours. Everyone here is allowed to express themselves but you'll all have to do it in a way that isn't rude or crude. Just because you don't agree with someone, doesn't mean you have to be pushy about it. So please express yourselves as cleanly as you can. I say this in the plural sense because I'd like for any replies to be civil when it comes to disputes around different opinions.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #817978  Replies : 37  Views : 1525
posté January 06, 2015, 04:57:08 | #14

Quote (zoombas @ 05 January 2015 18:04) *
Would be cool if a player gets attacked (in PvP) there could be a guild interface tab that would allow players to teleport to their guild member from anywhere in the world, to help back them up if they needed. (system similar to joining preceptor fights in dofus)

IMO this would bring an interesting roll to Guilds in regards to GvG and PvP in general.

Might consolidate some guilds too to form strong alliances.

It'd be great if that silly call for help button actually did what it sounds like it would do

I like the idea, it'd be really nice to have the option to jump into fights while they are still going on, too... however there needs to be a limit or certain instances where you can't do it...like in an official pvp match. Outside of a prestigious battle, anything can go...


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heres a cure to pvp one remove it because its killing the game or split all spells into pve and pvp versions alotting them to balance and fix pve and nerf to death everything for pvp players as pvp has killed wakfu and made every class pointlessly weak in pve

Drat, you're alive~

Still as pessimistic as ever I see, eh?

Great to see you, but I gotta say I don't really agree with you on your opinion. I mean, there are always those moments where someone is killing people who don't want to be involved in that type of combat, and I understand it can be really frustrating...

However, the point of this thread isn't so much how to cure the Current pvp system that we have... but rather what you or I or anyone would like to see in a player versus players system. Ideas and thoughts on your own ideal system of how pvp "should" be to you. It's all opinions and I'd be more than happy to hear your take on what a good pvp system should be or how things could be, ideally  


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #817767  Replies : 37  Views : 1525
posté January 03, 2015, 23:19:22 | #15

Quote (GodsGamer @ 03 January 2015 16:50) *
PvP should be the same as PvM.

What PvM'ers Have :

Random Mobs to Kill (For exp, kamas and item drops).
{Players can do what they like with mobs, that's the point of them}

Dungeons to Run (For exp, kamas and item drops / Tokens)
{Players are forced to group with each other in-order to have better chances at completing the dungeon's, that's the whole point of them}

What PvPers Have :

Open World PvP against other players (This is basically the same as choosing to fight random mobs instead of running a dungeon)
{Players will activate Wings if they want to participate}

Now what is missing in PvP?

------------------------------------------------------------------

What PvPers NEED is an Arena / Kolosium where they can search for other players, group up and fight each other for 'Tokens' that could then be used to obtain gear that isn't given by the Open World PvP system (Just like a dungeon item machine).
An arena solves a huge issue with the current pvp system. An open hub where players can interact with one another and participate in combat is essential. However I still think that player versus player (pvp) is a phrase that is being used a bit too freely.

Pking, is an activity where one player attacks another and kills them (or else they couldn't be called a pker if they weren't killing their target) This activity in my opinion is something that should be handled as a separate entity from actual "pvp" as it is mroe so "pkvp" (player killer versus player) or rather "AvT" (attacker versus target) Should people be encouraged to selecting random people to attack without the other parties consent and rewarded for killing a random passersby?

First thing to consider though is that the need for wings to be active in order to initiate combat against another player...needs to go away in order to allow people who wish to enact the activity currently known as pking. Reinstating this allows for there to be a clear difference between the standards and practices of player versus player organized and unorganized pvp.

I'd like for organized pvp to be reworded to "CvC" (combatant versus combatant)

A fight in an arena is organized player versus player combat where set rules and conditions have to be maintained in order to gain prestige (merit)

Outside of an arena players should still be able to participate in official "pvp" by simply consenting to battle.... I'm full of nonsense but yeah.


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Edit : I forgot something aswell, PvM'ers also have Quests that they can complete to give them Exp (sometimes Kamas too) and that's a good alternative to leveling. In Dofus, we had a system where PvP'ers would talk to an NPC and he would give them an item that would allow the player to find the location of another player (the one he's been assigned to kill) and then he would go hunt them down and fight them. (Kinda like a quest)
Quest would be an awesome addition but leveling up from choosing to fight other players rather than monsters isn't something I think should be instated... There needs to be a reason to participate in content after all... pvm, pvp... both are important. I feel like maybe pvp should instead give players more Spell Experience rather than normal experience. Eh, on second thought go ahead and give players the same exp in pvp. I do like the idea... though I don't think players should be gaining much level exp from and it should be harder to level up by fighting other players than it should be from fighting monsters.

The Dofus system sounds really interesting but hunting down people sounds pretty negative for such a prestigious activity like official pvp... maybe that would be entertaining for player killer hunting... if that were to be a thing.

I know I talk about my ideas too much and should embrace others views too, so I'll get better about doing that since everyone has their own view and ideals for this topic.

Speaking of which, Luftwaffles from Phaeris has opened his own thread with the same topic. Hopefully everybody who wants to talk about this kind of thing posts there too and we can relay ideas between this server and that one.


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PVP mechanics and how we use them.

Since there are some major fundamental issues with the pvp system, how guilds play into it, and how the Riktus need to fit in between all that as well... why not include some discussion around it and how we interact with PvP in the APAC region? To start off; Defending in PvP

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-Reality: If you are unflagged and in the group of a person that is being attacked in PvP, and that person in your group is flagged, you can jump to the defense of the person in your group and force a 2v1. Depending on the amount of merits the aggressor has, this can result in a small gain for the flagged person in your group, and a fairly significant loss for the aggressor, even though the odds were stacked against them.

-Suggestion: You cannot jump into the defense of another PvP flagged person (regardless if in group) unless you have activated your tag 5 minutes prior to combat and 5 minutes have passed since logging into that character.

-Reasons: I can understand people coming to the defense of another person being attacked (assuming they're flagged), perhaps they're waiting for a dungeon run to happen, or they're doing something for a friend, or its one of their alts. But what I don't get is people that are unflagged that have specifically elected to not participate in PvP - being in the same group as the flagged person or are simply nearby - are able to participate to the defense of the flagged person. I do not believe this is conducive to a PvP environment that is supposed to reward players that actively participate in PvP and instead just leads to abuse of a mechanic originally intended to protect players who genuinely prefer to stay out of PvP in the first place,

- People in government positions cannot effectively protect their nation buffs and Riktus cannot effectively disrupt ecosystems to gain their buffs if either PvP party are simply able to login-bomb aggressors with alts or several other people or unrelated unflagged ""bystanders"" are able to interfere without first turning their flag on to participate in a given conflict.

- People participating in the PvP ladder will inevitably meet increasing difficulties finding the other PvP players that will give them merit to progress due to the threat of login-bombs or "unflagged bystander aggression". Dont get me wrong though, I absolutely do not mind people jumping to the defense of another person, but it is an issue when the defenders are unflagged and have technically opted out of PvP are able to decide on the spot to join in whenever they want, which renders PvP'ers attempts at gaining merits just about futile.

However, maybe I'm just not quite understanding it, and am aware that I am biased by putting this kind of suggestion forward considering my PvP proclivities, so I would really like to hear others' constructive thoughts/criticisms about it, whether you PvP or not. Another one

Level/threat Identification


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-Reality: "Higher levels" - level 160-165's and PvP twinks deliberately sitting at 60-80-100 and so forth frequently capitalize on farming merits from lower level, severely under-geared or new players as this is simply more effective in merit-gain in terms of time and effort than attempting to hunt top-of-the-board PvPers that tag down and sit at Almanax chestbeating their latest Osa build on said lower level/undergeared/new players,

-Suggestion: Honestly, I'm not entirely sure, I think the ambiguity is fine over exact details of the would-be aggressor or defender, but considering Wakfu is largely dependent on gear I think a system that rates the total gear perhaps based on the level and if its runed or PvP gear and quantifies that into a kind of 'threat meter' guide on the players nameplate somewhere, which could be in the form of a visual guide like a coloured border/text or animated effect

-Reasons: Something along the lines of this would at least help minimize totally unnecessary PvP ganking when playing for merit/orb gain, and minimize the need to add to contacts/check the PvP board for levels (which is not always accurate), during a time which, the moment two flagged players see eachother, you will likely have a very small window to aggress the player before they either alt F4 or dragoturkey/zaap out of the area, and (maybe wishful thinking here but..) encourage PvP between players that are more closely matched to each other.

And last but not least..

PvP alts


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-Reality: Currently, the arguably most effective way to orb farm for PvP gear/costumes/etc is to level a character that is deliberately kept at the lower levels (ie: 60, 80, 100) to take advantage of players that are both higher and lower than their level range that would otherwise not entirely understand how the game works or woefully under-geared players in comparison to decked out alts with PvP gear supported by mains with the wealth and means to acquire the gear like Gelano's to dominate said players and top leaderboards in both merits and orbs with little investment compared to the higher levels.

-Suggestion: A bandaid would be to seperate the leaderboard categories for level ranges, but I think a more functional change would be to curb the amount of potential merits/orbs gained with a formula the lower level you are.

-Reasons: It is entirely unnecessary to gain such a massive amount of the new PvP currency at a level where PvP gear is very cheap, and allows players that don't regularly participate in PvP at the higher levels to gain cosmetics/PvP linked gear relatively easily without actually putting in much effort that would otherwise be very difficult to acquire, and also incentivises people partaking in PvP to further saturate the leaderboards with characters that aren't relevant or useful to a given nation should in the event that things like Conquest modes and GvG be brought into the Wakfu 'open world' in the future.

Also feel free to add your own suggestions for adjustments to the current PvP system and use the same or similar format above if you prefer, but please try to be clear and avoid hyperbole. Cheers! This post has been edited by Luftwaffles - January 03, 2015, 21:50:10.
I'm looking forward to viewing more from over at Phaeris server! I'll give my input on what was currently presented in due time.  


This post has been edited by Christian-CAO - January 03, 2015, 23:31:42.
Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #817263  Replies : 37  Views : 1525
posté January 03, 2015, 05:25:00 | #16

Quote (Beezle @ 03 January 2015 02:39) *
Yes the current pvp system is broken, but im not with all of these ideas. There's something about random pks that's fun.

My main issue with the current pvp system is seeing low arse lvl players with rank 1 wings or top ranking for the day. The difficulty for a higher lvl player to reach rank 1 is infinitely harder. High lvl players stay closer to dung entrances, Temple is a no pk zone, and low lvl player give us no merit point.

From what i recall there can only be one Rank 1 per server ( per nation?). A lvl 170 player can't make a lvl 80 player ( who's prob Rank 1 by now) lose any merit points, thus dethroning him is impossible. Being rank 1 should be exclusively to high lvl players ( within 20 lvls below the lvl cap). Seriously, would you really want your top ranking player be a lvl 80 player ?

An easy way to remedy this is to make low lvl players ,at a certain rank( 6 for example), lose a huge amount of merit point when attacked by high lvl players. The high lvl players don't need receive merit points in this situation, but this will at least cap low lvl players rank to 6; give them some incentive to lvl up; and leave the top 4 rank spots for High lvl pvp players.

I just think to be Rank 1 of your clan/server you need to have the best gear, the best thought out build and the skills to work around the hax classes or be one of the hax classes. The hax classes will always change with the revamps so there wont always be one class that's always Rank 1.

I jst can't stand seeing a low lvl being rank 1. It just looks stupid.

BGB
I agree with you that random pk's are fun! I just don't agree that people should get merit for it though. Catching people with their pants down shouldn't boost your prestige in the official rankings... However, I do see merit...in different kinds of pvp. From the classic Pk, one could only gain merit by defeating players who actually have their wings up since they signed up for the system. However you yourself have to have your wings up to gain merit. When your wings are down you can always kill for the fun of killing but you won't gain much from it... and with my odd end ideas I kind of want to see a bounty system as negative reinforcement to sort of deter people from choosing to do this type of thing since it's really only territory for role players and the daring... though I feel like the riktus clan should have a little prize bin based on how high your bounty is...and treat bounty like merit over there where the only law is don't mess with other riktus... rambling...

I too find it pretty odd and actually kind of "funny" (cosmic funny, not funny funny) that the highest ranked players are those who are low in level and are either abusing a broken system or just fighting among those in their level range as it's easier to gain merit form a low level than from a high one currently...


Quote (Madd1 @ 03 January 2015 03:25) *
There needs to be better incentives for team PVP and for new PVPers to come into the PVP economy and gain something out of it.

Currently the Nox server pvp scene from what I can tell is filled with maybe 3-5 strong 1v1 players, Alt+F4s who will run from anything they don't think they have a 90% to beat, Gankers who set up fights where they can abuse the system by adding multiple team members to fights, players who try to force team fights through antagonizing, SLEWS of low levels who I know nothing about, and the very-very few of us who don't give a damn about winning or losing and just fight for the fights sake.

You can solve almost all these problems by adding more incentive to team PVP and more incentive for entry level (people who currently have nothing) PVP.

I've outlined some of my ideas to boost the amount of merit in the economy and therefore boost the viability of PVP (double merit only, not orb, gains for rank 10 with diminishing returns up to rank four or five, let's be honest, rank 3 is where real PVP starts since it's where ranks are based on ranking).

I like Ele's ideas for improved incentive for team fights as well. Team PVP is where balance is achievable, not 1v1. Trying to incentivize players to enjoy team PVP will make PVP feel a lot less broken in a lot of ways.
Agreed, team pvp will be fun for sure! It just needs to be more desirable.... really odd that you don't gain more merit based on the amount of enemies you face at once currently... there should be a pool of merit on the line when large groups gather for combat...though I guess with great reward comes huge risk.. maybe the decay can be lower for the players in the group pvp like Ele said. It'd make the choice obvious for what is the most optimal way to gain merit... huge reward and lower risk... though I guess depending on the teams it just means longer fights... but that's more fun than these current short lived one versus one duels I get to see... though some actually last a decent amount of time. Some pretty tricky folks running around  


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #817065  Replies : 37  Views : 1525
posté January 03, 2015, 02:03:59 | #17

Quote (Micestorff @ 03 January 2015 01:59) *
Better fix: turn off the wings and wait for arena if someday comes. the less the amount of people with pvp on the less the merit farmers.

fun~, but remember this discussion is more or less just talking about what you would consider your ideal form of pvp and what you would like to see added to the games extensive experience. An arena would be lovely, but what about the arena, would you like to see? The options are boundless and the only limit is our imaginations since this is just idealism and the sharing of opinions. I'd love to read what you would like to see in the arena. There are so many possibilities!  


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #817019  Replies : 37  Views : 1525
posté January 03, 2015, 01:40:13 | #18

Quote (Micestorff @ 02 January 2015 13:22) *
Arenas and group pvp is the only way PK in any game is alwaays abused even more here when you get rewarded for stomping low levels players.

If you are low level: you get stomped
if you are not using a 1 vs 1 god tier class: you get stomped
if you are not wearing/leeching pvp set: you get stomped

really theres no reason to activate wings unless a outlaw is ruining you farm (even is just better to move to other place)

True, true... So let's fix that! Though pking isn't really abused so much as it is ... practiced. The current pvp we have happens to be just pking with prizes as I love to state. However that's just because that is how pvp (using the term loosely here) is set up. You only gain prizes if others are signed up for it. In all honesty, the only way any player should be gaining merit is by defeating other fighters in "official" battles. Sneak attacks shouldn't be rewarded... however I feel like there should be a system in place for players who idly attack any one and everything without the other parties consent... Bounties. No not ones other players place on you but something much like -cp used to be for outlaws in the past. The more unofficial fighting you do, the more of a bounty you wrack up. In turn the bigger your bounty, the harder it will be for you to gain merit since you will be hit with a 65% merit gain reduction so you will be gaining way less merit in your battles..and it only rises from 65% based on how high your bounty gets.... it should be known that it caps at 99% merit gain reduction.

Players who defeat another player who has a bounty win the kama placed on their head. Abuse wise it would obviously happen. However there should be a pretty large penalty for loosing based on how high your bounty was... the higher the bounty the more serious the penalty... penalties are a questionably bad idea though... worst case is giving the players involved a very painful wisdom, prospecting and stat debuff for loosing. Like DeDarm times ten maybe... but it would last at the base 5 hours of in game time. It would rise based on how high your bounty would be....

That aside though, as you said abuse is always a thing...

The current system is pretty daunting and a bit too focused on level capped players. This is why an idea of "organized" pvp needs to be a thing. What we have currently isn't organized at all. Tiers, ranks, placements, level requirements all of these should be factors for pvp to initiate. The most important aspect though is CONSENT. If you don't want to fight to the death then you don't have to...if it is an official merit based pvp battle that your aggressor is looking for. However if they are just attacking you then you have to deal with it.

This brings up another interesting proposition... We need new fighting options, at least in player versus player combat, like:
  • Flee- Basically what it sounds like. Runaway, your success is randomly generated but its chances increase based on your Left over Mp for the turn, dodge and initiative (all Sram, earth Enutrof, Rogues and Masqs are rolling around laughing) compared to your foe also your distance from the opponent ... you also can't run if you are in the tackle zone of your opponent. This is what most would probably click if they were being attacked by a player killer. With this in mind a player can only be given this option if they are being attacked. The attacker would have no such option. However, in an official fight both players have the option to flee. In those situations where you feel like running away for whatever reason you would choose to do so, you can. However the runner takes a moderate hit to their merit. With that though the "winner" of the bout would gain no merit at all. So if you really want to earn merit you better cling close to your target or else you risk someone being lame by running away. To combat the obvious abuse, players who "flee" won't be able to do so till their next turn. By selecting flee as an option it immediately ends their turn and they will not run till the following turn. This gives players who usually don't have a reason to be in the tackle zone a chance to force the fight to continue... with this in mind it is also an interesting way for melee classes to try and force long distance opponents into the tackle zone by feigning running away just to force them to get closer.

  • Forfeit- Giving up the match. A player who forfeits looses a moderate amount of merit and the opponent would only gain minor amounts of merit from the fight since it was ended prematurely. The option to forfeit would only be available in any "official" fight except for death matches.

  • Surrender- Giving up a fight. However unlike runaway this would then give your assailant options immediately... ye` or nay for allowing you to live, if it's a death battle that is. If they decline the offer of your forfeit then you die and loose merit and they gain merit. However if they accept the offer and let you live then you lose merit as usual but the opponent could win two times the amount of merit they would have gained. Yes this is something just asking to be abused however it is something that can only be initiated in a death battle. Death matches should cost a loosing player a heavy amount of merit. Remember that battles to the death would still fall under the Consent rule. Where both players agree to partake in the type of battle and both fit the criteria for the battle to take place.
All of these can be abused and I actually welcome it. Rank would mean much of nothing in formal fights anyway. It's in the Arena where real merit is gained and tested. That is how it "should" be.


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As long as there is a good incentive to PvP, e.g. lots of variety in rewards, and that there is an ongoing effort to punish those who leach, it should work out. A good way to promote group PvP would be to give bigger rewards for winning a group PvP fight with proportionally less merit decay per person added when defeated. E.g. if a 1 on 1 is a 100 merit if you win and -100 merit if you lose, then 6 v 6 cud be like 600 merit if you win and -300 merit if you lose. By having twice as much to gain than if you were to lose in a group setting, it would make it more appealing. 2 v 2, 3 v 3, 4 v 4, etc could offer similar benefits.
Firstly, Exelenore, I love your brief example of how merit should be handled between the winners and losers of an official match. Secondly, I agree that the rewards should be the driving force behind pvp. Why else would anyone fight each other past friendly duels? I do agree that the leeching of merit by forcing wins and loses as players try to cheat the system does need to be addressed... however I'd much rather not worry about punishing that lot and focus more on encouraging true pvp to take place. Greater merit rewards based on the levels of the combatants, their ranks in the ladder and the size of the teams compared to one another. Merit penalties should be in place to discourage fighting lower leveled players, in the form of gaining little to no merit. No Merit reductions though. Save that for other situations...

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Speaking of Merit decay though, I think it's a bit discouraging that the merit loss is so high to begin with. Realistically, if you want to get places in PvP, you should plan on never losing ever. That's a tall order and encourages people to play dirty and more importantly abuse the system. I think if they halved the general merit per loss combined with some real action taken against those who actively leach, and with more rewards added, that we would see more people willing to try PvP. Additionally, if they further made the win to loss amounts bigger for group PvP, it would encourage team combat more often.
truer words have never been spoken. The amount of merit lost between inactivity in pvp .... I wonder how much should be lost... or if any. Honestly I feel like maybe a player shouldn't loose merit unless they do something worth loosing merit (like for example, running away or giving up a fight) and they be allowed to keep the merit they have since while inactive the only thing that can happen to them is some one else over takes their rank on the ladder and they drop down the list in the standings.

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If they want to take it even further, they could design a twice a week guild based PvP war that mixes objective play with guild vs guild combat. There could be targets behind fortifications on large maps with choke points and various objects the defending party must protect with defenses they can activate, a multi party raid system with guild ally support. You can get very creative with a system like this, making it span across several battles and maps of outdoor and indoor field and castle environments with narrow passages and such, it could be pretty neat.
This sounds awesome! I really would love to be a part of a skirmish like that. Objective game play is my favorite kind. It would be something really ambitious.

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The rewards could be anywhere from a +100 pp / wisdom bonus for the winning guild for a week, to special legendaries or exotics or relic pieces, to neat costumes and auras, unique mounts, or maybe even special haven world buildings and upgrades. I think with how much time such a system would take to participate in, that there should be some sort of reward just for making an effort whether or not you win; maybe getting rewards based on objectives being completed or doing well in certain parts of the fight, or just not quitting when things seem to not be going your way. Obviously the winning side would get a lot more stuff but it should still feel worthwhile for the side that loses to have stuck it through for 2 hours or whatever while doing their best.
Great reward suggestions, and I agree that just being a part of it should give you something in return for time invested. The objectives idea sounds good for this like winning a certain number of battles/ getting to a certain rank/ defeating some one who has a high rank etc... it'd be nice to have something to show for your achievements since currently everything could be stripped form you the moment you start loosing merit.

Thanks for sharing your ideas, I appreciate the amount of thought behind them.


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Bring Kolossium to Wakfu!
GodsGamer, That would be interesting to see... though I would love for Wakfu to have something to call its own. However something like it would be well received by a large amount of Kolossium lovers. Tweaking it to fit in and be something balanced for this game would be nice.

Love the ideas guy, I can't wait to read some more.


This post has been edited by Christian-CAO - January 03, 2015, 02:00:09.
Reason for edit : bounty additions
Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #817012  Replies : 37  Views : 1525
posté January 02, 2015, 09:32:45 | #19
Can we talk about pvp (?) Really grateful to the developers for attempting to create a real pvp system.

It's a work in progress but it does cure that itch for fighters and created a real niche for combat enthusiasts who had long sense abandoned the idea that pvp in wakfu could have a point or actual purpose...

However, even with the good this new system has brought to the game these few months that it has been out...

There are always ways to improve the feature since the pvp system we have currently is just pking with prizes...

My opinion is my own, and I am sure there are plenty who enjoy this roughly young player versus player combat experience... however I have trouble understanding the reasons behind allot of the decisions behind some of the mechanics of how pvp is initiated.

You can only attack players if your wings are up... Let's just hypothetically say that...with no merit involved, I just want to be a jerk one day. and I want to kill people... I would gain nothing for it since Most of my targets wouldn't have their wings up and all that jazz... currently only wing toting players are allowed to fight other players even players who have their wings down or no wings at all. So, players who aren't into pvp are still susceptible to being attacked by a jerk but they can never retaliate without jumping through minor but still proverbial hoops that no one should have to jump through.
that's not fair for allot of reasons, here's what I mean...
wings... are for gaining merit right?
Why should I have my wings up if I want to kill some one?
You have to be in a guild that is linked to your nation to participate in pvp... that guild also has to want to be involved with pvp, if your guild doesn't want to then you can't be a part of it unless you join the riktus clan... but that's lame.
The options are too ridiculous and make no sense.
We should have open world killing along with the current pvp system for gaining merit by means of attacking other players with wings up.

This way you can either kill just to kill or kill for merit based on your targets.
We can have both, it's no big issue to throw out an idea but I'm sure it's the coding that they'd have trouble with. It's real work and nothing is easy. It'll work out one day... it'd be perfect "for me" if we had that old open pking system and wing ranked pvp.

Shoot, we should even have clean competitive sparring matches. Those are matches where neither player dies in the end but fight for friendly competition and still gain a very small amount of merit (like 1), but abuse is strong in the air...they could even be officially initiated with an Ante` being brought up by the fighters involved and the winning player/players get the pot...

Who could ever forget about an Arena...for official duels where the rewards are even greater and where tournaments could be held, where custom maps could be generated and official events hosted by players, GM's and Developers could be initiated and organized.
It'd be a nice open pvp focused aspect of the game with structure and chaotic fighting going on...
On top of that we have Nation wars to think about ... even guild skirmishes... Wars however, need a major improvement but that'll come with the map revamps for the nations.We need territory zones to conquer... solid reasons to attack another nation. We need an aspect that is story driven involving the obvious world issue of the steady decrease of Dry Land since those tears aren't going to just stop flowing. It takes supplies and resources to a whole other level of importance...
Winners of wars can end up gaining an increase in the Treasury. Kamas from no where being slapped onto the winning nations along with a massive material storehouse inventory.
You could have hundreds of seeds popping into the storehouse for trees, creatures, plants, and of course plenty of ores too... more or less based on the defeated nations prime resources and generated as such:

  • Scara,chafer and stalagmote seeds with iorn and magnesium from Brakmar
  • Marine creatures, Sharkie, and Crab seeds with salt and hazy lead from Sufokia
  • Field plant, Toads and Crackler seeds with wheat (HA, amakna) and silver from Amakna
  • Blibli, Moogrr and Whirly seeds with copper and gold bauxite from Bonta
I would love it if we could be allowed to introduce foreign creatures to your own home land just to see what kind of impact it would have on the environment... because there
should instances where you'll have creatures killing creatures. This is all supposed to be made relevant by the return of a revamped Orgests chaos where Nation leaders have the ability to fix what is broken by Orgest's Chaos with mildly meaningful treasury funds and or resources in the storerooms. The more resources you have the better off your nation will be once trouble rears its tear stained face. Seriously, The newer Chaos should create turmoil in selected zones like before but it shouldn't be too crazy. It should only affect creature populations, the usual craft station damages and resources like flowers and trees. A decently supplied Nation should be able to fix the repairs with a click of a button from the Nations HQ... other players can always donate to the storeroom or at any nations outpost by speaking to Jonk.

There should be plenty of positive reasons for wanting to have a full inventory of resources and a healthy amount of kama in the treasury as well. However we can talk about all this if anyone has anything they to have on their mind...
Anyway, these are just ideas. Anyone can have an idea... though few like to vocalize their thoughts to others. I'll just leave this here since I think it's nothing more than
that. An idea. I like some of it but the War half i think should be ignored from this current topic...
but I typed about it a little because I wanted to remember some things about it and hope that someone brings up some really neat ideas here about it.... though this topic might fit better in the ideas section I'd like a discussion on what others would consider their ideal pvp system.

Ideas are always fun to share and it'd be a shame if people kept quiet because they think their idea isn't worth sharing. So share away, I love a stirring conversation and hope others enjoy similar discussions.


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