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How's Wakfu Doing?
posté February 09, 2011, 01:03:01 | #1
How's Wakfu Doing? Hi guys,
 
I'm an old player of Dofus, way back from the times of the Black Tofu quest in Tainela, no Incarnam, no Pandawas and everything. I was just wondering how's wakfu doing. Ever since Ankama announced the game I've been following the game from afar, reading some forums and checking out the website from time to time and since, like many, I have not been able to download the game client yet (and I did sign up for the closed beta before January 31st but am not complaining about not receiving the beta key yet!), I wanted to know from those who are testing out the game how is it running? Did it meet up to you expectations? Are there so many bugs yet that the Open Beta will not be until 2012 or not even then? Is the new battle system and spell leveling so different from our good-old Dofus?
 
To sum it up in three words: How's Wakfu doing?
 
Thanks for the info!


posté February 09, 2011, 01:14:25 | #2
There's not much skills to choose from, compared with Dofus. You're given 3 elemental skill tree with 4 skills in each tree and some passive abilities. Though you can master all the element its not really recommended. Ecosystem mechanic is kinda so-so. Frame rate sucks when you're running around ( The camra moves with you)


posté February 09, 2011, 01:21:59 | #3
However, is it more interesting to make a 2 element Hybrid Build, or a passive/elemental "hybrid" build?
 
Is the game still made in Flash with Cache storage, like Dofus 2.0? Woulnd't the Cache system be helpful since the frame rates act slowly as it is a "camera's stuck on you" style, way differente from the "move around the still maps" of Dofus?


Lord Madgobb * Member Since 2008-11-24
posté February 09, 2011, 03:05:09 | #4
first a small correction you have 5 spells peer elemental then you have 10 support spells which some are passive (some classes have to many in my opinion), the support spells don't lvl like the elemental one (which the more you use them the more xp they get), the support are more or less like dofus you get 5 points when you lvl that you can put at support spells and/or characteristics you choose

In the opposite of Dofus, wakfu is a big open area when you run around and the camera follows you  and the game is made in Java

And yeah i like wakfu but it still have a lot of things that need to be change and add, but hey!! this is still a beta


posté February 09, 2011, 04:44:27 | #5
Preface: I'm really sleepy right now and my memory of Dofus is pretty flimsy (I have not played Dofus since Beta) so this will be a bit jumbled and hard to follow possibly. Just a warning.

Okay... so let's see.

When you enter a battle, you don't really load up a new screen. The map you're on actually converts into the battlefield. This makes for (in my opinion)  a much smoother transition into battles, and also has the added side bonus that you can actually observe people fighting on the map while you're, say, gathering resources. There is no longer a list of current battles to spectate. Although you can still spectate by right-clicking on someone in the fight and choosing the option. The only real downside that I've noticed to this is the battlefield seems noticeably smaller - which is kind of a bummer for ranged classes, although not terribly damaging. It makes for faster battles with less waiting to meet up with the enemy, though. (NOTE: I'm still only in my 20s and hanging around the early maps, so maybe this changes on harder maps.)

I personally really love the way the skill system is set up. Yes, there are fewer skills to choose from. I imagine eventually that will become very disheartening when you're level 50 and have been using the same skills for 49 levels with very little noticeable change. In fact, if they do not ever plan on expanding the skillset, I can see it being a gamebreaker. Which is really unfortunate, because the skill leveling system is wonderful and really rewards you for making use of the skills you like the most, and allows you to use every skill in your arsenal if you so choose without a terribly noticeable downside. Sure, leveling every skill in a line to 2 in order to unlock them all will take a bit of exp away from your main skills, but it is miniscule and it well worth the effort in some cases - After all, you only need a knockback skill at Level 1 to get full use of it in a tight situation, etc. 

I suppose it is a bit of a trade-off. You get this really interesting skill leveling system where you can have access to all the skills, but the trade-off is that by getting all of the skills right out of the gate there is never going to be a "Yay! I got a new skill!" after, say, level 5 (which is being generous - you could easily unlock every ACTIVE skill in your arsenal without hitting level 5 or even coming close, depending on what you're fighting). 

I really, really hope there will be more skills in the future. Perhaps "quests" that unlock the potential in your current skills, beefing up their damage and adding different effects (both statistically and visually). Something along those lines. Just a random idea. Like I said, never getting a new skill after Level 5 is a major bummer that really distracts from the point of leveling in an MMORPG. It really just becomes all about the numbers, even moreso than in the past

Speaking of quests ... urgh. Probably my biggest complaint. I know some people don't really care, but I am a HUGE questing nerd. Half of the fun in MMOs for me is going out and doing every possible quest. The more the better, that's what I say. Unfortunately by nature the game makes that difficult - there are basically no NPCs, since Wakfu really is meant to be a "living" world where 99% of the population is made up of player characters.

They attempt to solve the lack of quests with the introduction of Achievements, but they just ... don't cut it. First and foremost there are VERY few of them. Granted I am sure more will be added, but it needs to be said. Worst of all the only reward for any achievement is more equipment for your Gremlin. Which is fine and all - I'm a big fan of the gremlins (when they're not repeating the same thing they just said 20 times over) - but it gets stale. You can only ever have two pieces of aesthetic equipment and three types of "boosts" equipped at any given time. Eventually you're going to find what works and the rest are all rendered useless. 

It would be nice if you could be reward with character equips or even EXP for the achievements in addition to the gremlin equips since there are absolutely no quests, that's all I'm saying.

All in all I'd say Wakfu is off to a great start. Well ... a great restart, seeing as this game has been starting for 3 years now. It shows though. They've learned from their experience with Dofus and the previous 3 years working on the game, and it shows. With the right amount of dedication to making it better and prolonged improvements, it could really be something amazing. It is definitely unfinished, and definitely could be improved, but it is solid foundation. 

As far as bugs ... I've seen few. I don't see any reason why the game can not go public in April/May as planned. The few bugs are frustrating (inability to act in battle, etc.) but they seem simple enough to fix.

You might notice I've neglected to mention the ecosystem ... system. That is on purpose. I'm completely apathetic about it. I don't like it but I do not dislike it. It is ambitious, and time will tell what it turns into with a fully populated server, but for now it is just sort of ... there. Which isn't a good thing, I suppose. Neither is that fact that most people don't even really seem to understand Wakfu/Stasis, or the point of it all. We'll see.

... oh wow. I don't think you wanted a book. Sorry! I better stop now before I get even more carried away. So much for being sleepy.

One more thing and then I'm REALLY finished, I promise!


Quote (This2Lu @ 09 February 2011 01:21) *
However, is it more interesting to make a 2 element Hybrid Build, or a passive/elemental "hybrid" build?

 
It really depends on the class I suppose, but it isn't unfeaseable. I'll use my current class as an example.

I am a Fire Cra. Most people seem to be going the Air route, because it has the greatest damage potential. I really only went Fire out of nostalgia since that was my first character way back when in the Dofus beta. It wasn't until I was already level 10 and pretty into my character (with high leveled skills because I am obsessed with seeing numbers go up!) that I witnessed the potential Air Cras had.

My first reaction was "***!" and to just remake my character or, at best, refocus my efforts to leveling the Air skills.

Instead I decided to go the hybrid route. By leveling the main Air Cra skills I can still utilize their preferred strategy under the correct conditions (though with slightly less damage output, with lower leveled skills and Fire-focused equipment) while still being a badass Fire Cra in any other situation. 

I am still more profficient in fire, but I am profficient enough in air to not regret my decision. 

What I am trying to say is that a "Jack of all trades" sort of character build is perfectly managable if you have the patient and, as always, can deal with the fact that you might not be as powerful as a one-build character. Hybrids will never be as powerful as pure builds, but the skills are balanced enough (at least, in this example) for them to be near-equals if only because they're prepared for more situations.

Bottom line: Hybrids are no so horribly broken that they are useless in a fight, so there is absolutely no reason not to experiment. Especially with the way skills work in Wakfu - you can literally be a master of both with the right time and dedication, with your equips ultimately determing whether you are an Air Build or a Fire Build, etc.


Squited Arachnee * Member Since 2007-03-17
posté February 09, 2011, 09:52:08 | #6
No quests? Try doing a challenge. Sure, some of them are slightly in French still, but the guide should cover that.

About builds? I'm an omni Cra. Mainly fire, but I'm getting pretty strong in air, and my earth isn't too bad.
Air (Homing Arrow) is great for range, or pushback (Recoil Arrow and Windy Beacon), or simply too much damage (Windy Beacon + Homing Arrow). Plaguing Arrow being able to hit through objects is great also.
Fire, Blazing Arrow is the way to go. A White-Hot (beacon) with Blinding Arrow can do significant damage, but requires careful placement. Perfect for midrange players.
Earth is the close-combat side. Arrow Blow will take care of any enemies that get close enough to lock you, and Seismic Beacon is good when you're (almost) surrounded. Piercing Arrow's bounce is good for multiple enemies, and when combined with a Seismic or two can be devastating.


This post has been edited by Oamoka - February 11, 2011, 01:50:59.
Reason for edit : What do you so dislike about links, eh?
posté February 09, 2011, 09:55:53 | #7
I take back what I said about "not much skills" I took a look at the Cra in dofus. It looks like Dofus had about 20 skills and Wakfu I think 25, so...


posté February 09, 2011, 17:59:19 | #8
Well,
 
I have to say that the way the new spell system works will make the game a bit more interesting on one side, while in another side it makes it boring. Of course I have not tested it yet, but from what you guys have told me so far, and from what I've read, I come to this conclusion of the new spell system:
 
Pros:
 
» Going hybrid is not really a bad option. From  Dofus times, going hybrild meant being more flexible, but much less powerful until later levels. With this new kind of spell system, I would guess that having two or three differente elements since start, would not be a bad idea after all. Although most MMOs don't use the Dofus system, acting out this way, with a single element (fire, air, water and earth) bound to your character for higher and more effective damage input, this new Wakfu system seems to take care of that.
» PvP will be a bit more tactical and surprising. Back in Dofus if you see a Cra wearing Toady hat with  Mad Tofu cloak, you'd think "Hell, another one of those Stroken-Cra-Agi-Farmers again, it's Plaguing Arrow and pushback, and blablabla", if you'd see an Iop wearing Royal Gob Hat (Dora for the rich ones) and a Crocodyl Cape (Don't really remember the name, and of course they could be using something better), you'd think "Hell, another of those Stroken-Iop-Agi-Farmers again, it's Strenghtstorm, Teleport, Intimidation, and blablabla". With the spell system I could see some Agi Cras using some Strenght equips to pass as an Earth Cra, but really is an Agi Cra woping that Iops Head, and using the Strenght equips to compensate for the "not-so-high" earth damage. (Although of course, it would no be sooooooooooo effective, but it would be quite a shock to the opponet, makin PvP more tactical)
» Less trial-and-error builds. If you are at level 20, Wind Eni, and at this point you say to yourself, "Wow, my Eni sucks! Guess I have to delete it and remake it... And lose all the time I invested in this little guy! :'(", well I'm guessing all you'd have to do is invest on that Fire Eni you would want so much and not lose all the time you invested in a Level 20 Eni. Plus,  you'd have a powerful Fire Eni in the future with a little bit of Air Damage for those Fire Resist monster or PvP players.
 
Cons:
 
» At some point you'll be quite tired of using the same skills over, and over, and over again. If you want a really powerful Plaguing Arrow, well, you pretty much HAVE to use it ALL THE TIME. So it will eventually become a bit of boredom doing the samething all the time.
» With the use to level up your skill system, you'll have a few poweful spells, but most will not be so effective. In Dofus once your spell reache level 5 (before levell 100+) it would be at it's maximum effeciency, and you could invest in other spells. I guess that by this way, you would probably have 2 or 3 powerful ones, and other not so effective, and if you wanted it to be effective you would have to use it a lot... again.
» You would need to invest a lot of time in leveling the spells, fighting some monster more than you'd like to and eventually have the feeling that you're doing the same thing for days and days. I guess I wouldn't like that feeling.
 
But again, I have not tested the game yet, so my assumptions may be very wrong, or totally wrong. I only posted what I would guess it is, from what you posted here. I'll post again later, this post has become huge.
 
Thanks again for the info guys!


posté February 09, 2011, 18:20:17 | #9

Quote (This2Lu @ 09 February 2011 17:59) *
Cons:
 
» At some point you'll be quite tired of using the same skills over, and over, and over again. If you want a really powerful Plaguing Arrow, well, you pretty much HAVE to use it ALL THE TIME. So it will eventually become a bit of boredom doing the samething all the time.
» With the use to level up your skill system, you'll have a few poweful spells, but most will not be so effective. In Dofus once your spell reache level 5 (before levell 100+) it would be at it's maximum effeciency, and you could invest in other spells. I guess that by this way, you would probably have 2 or 3 powerful ones, and other not so effective, and if you wanted it to be effective you would have to use it a lot... again.
» You would need to invest a lot of time in leveling the spells, fighting some monster more than you'd like to and eventually have the feeling that you're doing the same thing for days and days. I guess I wouldn't like that feeling.
 
 Umm your right in certain aspects but in dofus you had to use a skill over and over because that was the one you had leveled, + if you use several skills its better than just 1 so its better here imo.
If you lvl all your spells they'l all be effective, you just have to spend your time doing it. So you could had all your 15 skills(elemental ones) all maxed, obviously that would be very hard but its doable.


posté February 09, 2011, 18:50:39 | #10

Quote (Finecry @ 09 February 2011 18:20) *
 Umm your right in certain aspects but in dofus you had to use a skill over and over because that was the one you had leveled, + if you use several skills its better than just 1 so its better here imo.
If you lvl all your spells they'l all be effective, you just have to spend your time doing it. So you could had all your 15 skills(elemental ones) all maxed, obviously that would be very hard but its doable.
   
 
Although true you would wind up using the same skill over and over, you would have every 10 levels a skill maxed out, so you would not wind up using the same skill all the time. An example, which is the one I use almost all the time, is the Cra. An Agi Cra's build in Dofus generally contains these skills:
 
Retreat Arrow Lv 5
Critical Shooting Lv 5
Distant Shooting Lv 5
Plaguing Arrow Lv 5
Powerful Shooting Lv 5
Absorptive Arrow Lv 5
Weapon Skill (or Anything you Want) Lv 5 < This would make for a Level  71 Character (So he could use Absorptive Arrow)
 
That means 7 Skills "Maxed" (Until level 100+, that is)
 
So yes, you would use the same skill over and over, but under different circumstances. An Agi Cra will use Retreat Arrow to keep enemies far away from him, Critical Shooting to increase damage outputo (at critical strike chance), Distant Shooting to maintain yourself afar from opponents and still be able to hit tem, Plaguing Arrow to hit enemis without LoS, Powerful Shooting to increase damage output for few rounds, Absorptive Arrow to deal massive damage and heal yourself, and Weapon Skill to do increased damage when the enemy is too near to be attacked by Skills, or for the nice damage itself (maybe even challenges, although not so much).
 
I would guess that the difference is that in Dofus you would not have to use Plaguing Arrow hundres of times for it to be maxed, nor Absorptive Arrow for it to be maxed. Therefore you could go all out and use whater you wanted, because it did not matter what you did, all you needed was to level up and get that extra point. In Wakfu, I would guess I would be restrained to use Plaguing Arrow as much as I could, even though I did not want at times, so that it becomes Maxed. Of course I could alternate between say, Retreat Arrow and Plaguing Arrow, maxing both together, but it would take a much longer time for both to be maxed. While in Dofus you could be using Retreat Arrow all the way until level 100 and still maxing other spells, in Wakfu I'll be "forced" to use some skills I do not want to use at times, just so it levels.
 
Then again, I do not know how it really works out when playing the game, but in theory I see it this way.
 
Keep on contributing guys, I'm enjoying this discussion. It makes me know more about the game, until I can test it  out myself. It also helps some other curious likes like me know more about the game so far.


Ugly Gobball * Member Since 2010-05-01
posté February 10, 2011, 07:20:05 | #11
I am new to Wakfu and have just decided to become invovled in the community, l have read everyones post on this topic and l peronsally like what their doing with the spell system by giving you all your spells at level 1. I find this good because back in the old days of Dofus before 2.0 l remember leveling a Chance Enu was a pain, seeing as you didn't get your first chance spell coins throwing till something like lvl22, and back then it took a while if you were a new player. Having the versatility to be able to go a hybrid or omni build seems like a really cool idea, l personally never tried that out in Dofus. Overall l personally like what their doing with the spell system and the ability be able to pick what spells you want to use from level 1 will definitely motivate me to try a build that l might have not wanted to try in Dofus because id have to wait till Level 30 for example to really get the benefit out of that build.


posté February 10, 2011, 19:13:50 | #12
I don't have a forme opinion yet. I want to try first, give my opinion later. I know what anyone who's reading the thread might be thinking: "What do you mean not give your opinion? You just did a few posts back !" Again, I would like to say that I can only assume that what I said will be as I said. To really know if the cons and pros are as I said, I will have to test it and know more about it myself.
 
And yes Soulbound, an Enutrof had to have level 26 I think in order to get Coin Throw, to cause at least some damage. But still to this day, an Enutrof's true power comes only at 60+. A fearsome opponent after that, until then... Well, you'd better level up!
 
Ok, but changing the topic a little from the new spell system, can anyone who's testing out the system explain to us how is that Wafu vs. Stasis system working? From what I've read it is similar to the Brak/Bonta view. Since the good guys (Wakfu people) eventually hunt the bad guys (Stasis people) in order to put them into jail (Do you get anything special for doing so?). But, on the other side, would Stasis people have any other advantage rather than the badass (Is this offensive?) look and the extra resources they get by poundin the environment? Because if Wakfu people get bonuses for hunting down Stasis people, I would rather be Wakfu, hunt down some bullies and get a little prize for keeping my nation clean. Of course there are those who will try to be the infamous outlaw who no Wakfu people can break and send to jail (This guy will probably have his own gang or something!). In general, can anyone tell us more abou this new system?
 
And one more thing, has leveling up become more/less difficult, or is it still the same? I remember that in Dofus up until the 40's you'd be all happy and all that you're getting  1, 2, 3 levels a day playin only 1~2 hours a day. But into the 40's and 60's you'd get at the maximum 1 level a day playing at 1~2 hours a day. And after that, well, go PvP dude, with nice gear to get those levels quick. (Of course this is Soloing, if you're in groups, which is the main point of the game, you'd be able to level up a lot faster! But I take into consideration that not everyone starts out in a big guild with lots of friends, or some, like me, just like to play by themselves or few friends who never log in! xD)
 
Curious guy, waiting for more interesting debate and answers.


posté February 10, 2011, 22:41:28 | #13
Well, i just started playing yesterday, got an invite since i've played on other Wakfu Betas, the game has a nice feeling right now, but i'm still pretty low.

-The Cra's beacons, which were a real pain in the rear end to level up, are going a lot better these days. Another thing i've noticed is that it's not so complicated to level up yourself and your skills as you go along. There was a big problem with skill leveling on the last beta: your first 5 levels were THE MOST important! You had to level those 5 first levels on level 1 monsters just to pump some real exp on your skills. Now, it feels more natural.
- The planting part of the ecosystem got improved quite a bit, you now know the chance of planting (fauna or flora).
- The tutorial is ok, it's in english (FINALLY) but it's smaller than the last beta one, which i found quite nice to do.
- I still haven't had big issues with the game speed, i find it has improved since last time.

As for builds, i'm pretty much lost... I'm doing Air/Earth Cra, yeah it won't be ubber damaging, but i still like the flexibility and being able to use a wider range of spells. But that might change in the future. As for skills... That's my problem, i have no clue on what's efficient and what's useless... Guess i'll have to experiment a bit. And i still find that having friends to play with helps a lot. Remember, you're playing a big sandbox-styled game, having someone with you will help on the leveling and fun part quite a bit. I'll have to think about joining a guild.


Short Strich * Member Since 2007-04-11
posté February 11, 2011, 06:27:38 | #14
exlenne.. ur post was hawt


Bellaphone Lover * Member Since 2006-01-22
posté February 11, 2011, 06:46:24 | #15
Here's my first impression:

Starting the game as an Eniripsa, everything feels fluid, movement works fine, camera works smoothly, I've had no problem with Lag or any drop in framerates, everything works suprisingly smooth, Everything looks very nice, from Incarnam to the Amakna Island(I've yet to go to Bonta) Although I am a bit disapointed by the lack of versitality on Eniripsa's, they still play some what unique but suffer from a lack of any decent ranged Spells, unless I've yet to find +Range gear if they have boostable Range,
the marks work really nice in your favour, some of them arent that great(The ap one for example) Itsade has saved my tail several times, and I like
the way they work, Coney at first was a bit of a clunky mechanism but you get used to popping one out, I wish it was a support spell to summon a Coney insted
of a mark, The lack of the Trademark Stimulating word was also rather...disapointing, but it works, alot of the passive moves are over whelming at first, but you
really get a hang of the way they work after you test them and play a bit, Air spells are also nice, i like the way they include some nice status effects with them and deal
some nice average damage, Enirpsa's work well in groups from my experience.

Professions are fine, learning them is a great way to make players explore and want to learn them on their own, and also offer a wide range of professions
to cater to everyone, the environment and monster system is good, although I hope no one abuses it and makes poor gobballs go extinct~.

All in All, game works fine, its fine to play, needs some tweaking, but thats expected from a closed beta, works well.


posté February 16, 2011, 01:32:25 | #16
 I think the new system is awsome, though i do see the problem with it geting boring, not because useing the same spells is a bore because each monster requires a dfferent strategy, therefore the same spells will be used but in different ways. The problem that i am seeing is the exp for spells is lagging as aposed to the chars exp. Even spells that are used all the time dont gain levels at the same pace as the char and eventually there is a grind were the player has to fnd mobs that are good for spell lvling and camp them for a long time while spells try to catch up with char (SNOOFLES). There needs to be a more balanced lvling system that allows a char to enter an area perform the available tasks in that area and not have to grind to much before ready for the next area. I felt that dofus did a good job of this especially in v2, more of that needs to start making its way into wakfu. 


Lord Madgobb * Member Since 2008-11-24
posté February 16, 2011, 03:04:52 | #17

Quote (chrisradnav @ 16 February 2011 01:32) *
 I think the new system is awsome, though i do see the problem with it geting boring, not because useing the same spells is a bore because each monster requires a dfferent strategy, therefore the same spells will be used but in different ways. 

and that is not good?! O_o

about the spell xp you must fight mobs that are around the spells lvl. For example if a spell is at lvl 2x then you should figth mobs that are at lvl 2x or higher...