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Madd1's profile
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Member Since : 2012-04-11
1899 Posts (1.36 per day)
Most active in : General Discussion
posté Today - 03:04:35 | #1

Quote (Nox16 @ 11 February 2016 01:31) *
Well tbh the whole distortion thing was a bug its pretty op in its own ways but it requires two xelors who actually want to do it lol.
I used to do it all the time when I had two-Xelor pre-revamp in my first 6man team. I don't think being able to do this is a bad thing, especially if the state is limited to one Xelor's cast of 3. (Though, I don't think that's necessary either )

I mean... Sacrier's Motion Sickness continues to other characters. The single target damage a 3Sac, Enu, (DPT that can push/Pull high square #s and probably heal), Feca team could produce is wild. It could even make otherwise unviable things like Enuzerker-teleport decent DPT. I had an idea that revolved around using this too, but don't have the patience to make enough Sacs to make it work (and would also have to stop playing Xelor).

Multiple Pandawas stack and can Trigger Dizzy. I saw Elenore use this to great effect.

Fecas Debuffs continue to other characters. As do Sadidas, Masks, Osas, ect.... I just don't think it's a broken mechanic to be able to redirect 6AP in damage on a 29d/ap spell. It's not even that good of a mechanic except in specific setups or fights.

I honestly think this should be a Xelor duo feature and will probably put it in suggestions in the hopes that it becomes functional again.

I guess there's always someone like me trying to think of ways to maximize the system like that. Too bad, I would have enjoyed being comically strong for being smarter than most players about my class. I'm going to rethink my approach, because I may want to lay out slightly differently now.


Thread : Xelor  Preview message : #942821  Replies : 6  Views : 264
posté Today - 02:54:40 | #2

Quote (mayroskobat @ 11 February 2016 01:40) *
I'm currently lv.120 and I was wondering if i should replace Dial Master which just got lv.2 to Carnage,

My current passive build : Rollback, Clock Master, Temporal Prism, and it used to be Carnage, now i placed lv.2 Dial Master,

What u guys think ?

I'm fire/ air btw


You can test the damage to verify, but I'm willing to bet you'll get more final damage from 5% extra final on Dial Tile and +2AP after casting Dial in most fights than you would from +10% flat damage.

That's because if 2AP equals 5% of the AP you use in the fight (40AP), you're still effectively producing 5% damage increase.

And at 150, you can just add Carnage. Or, you can potentially swap Clock Master for Carnage (Especially if Clock Master is lvl 1 at 120, I forget as I'm not able to log in right now).

Passives are easy to test since you can swap without respec.


Thread : Xelor  Preview message : #942817  Replies : 10  Views : 753
posté Today - 02:15:48 | #3
The biggest problems with air/fire in PVM is large AP turns (unless you charge for Hydrust turn) and lowest resistance flexibility.

EX:
Click here
Click here
Click here
Click here

All mobs that will work better with different combinations. You should aim for at least 1turn, 1kill, to be efficient to a team late-to-end game (IMHO)

As for high AP turns, the most efficient combination for Air/Fire is Age/Hand/Hand, which is 42+125+60+125+60 or 412/12AP which is 34.3~ d/ap, but when using burn, 10AP (pre-aged) burn only produces 30.6 d/ap

If I use Desynch, Time Control, Aging, Sandglass, Sandglass, 3AP Burn I get
25+42+50+17+50+17+63+36 damage for 300, of which 161 is at -40% water resistances, causes an extra +6% final damage from Temporal Prism, and can potentially more efficiently assault an enemies weaker elements.

Another possible rotation would be, TC Enemy (Not necessary), TC Self, Sandglass, Sandglass, Desynch, Burn. This would only cost 7-8AP

Damage looks like 50+50+63+18+18 = 199, or 28.4d/AP , or 25+50+50+63+18+18 = 224 damage or 28d/AP of which 161 damage is at -40% water res.

Again this is for 7 and 8 AP respectively.

You also get better AoE options, and better PVP options, since PVP is the one place where minor AP steal for disruption is EXCEPTIONALLY useful.

Tri also relies much less on Tick/Tock

It's easier to understand if you play it regularly, or just play a ton of Xelor, I suppose.


Thread : Xelor  Preview message : #942812  Replies : 65  Views : 6653
posté Yesterday - 22:07:30 | #4
The three characters you like playing. Otherwise you'll quit in a few months, just like 85% of all players.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #942770  Replies : 12  Views : 192
posté Yesterday - 20:34:03 | #5

Quote (shankissimo @ 10 February 2016 04:17) *
BTW Zone control master is Sinistro Xelor, not Hydrant, epic dmg (when 10 sinistros hit you every turn twice per turn, you get it? in pure-ST build they'd also do insane damages) and AP reduction. They can beat Sadis too because Sinistros instakill greedies when they spawn.
Eeeeeeeeeeeeeh..... I'd have to see this to believe it. A true tank Sadi should have enough HP on greedies to survive a Sinis hit, even in an all-out-damage Xelor scenario.

What Sinistro DOES is automatically 100% DISABLE any Greedy in range, with -1AP, basically deleting them from fight. (They'll die before they get enough nettle to attack)


Thread : General  Preview message : #942759  Replies : 243  Views : 8287
posté Yesterday - 20:22:15 | #6

Quote (blazakkhakabow @ 10 February 2016 14:25) *

Quote (Aelorr @ 10 February 2016 03:03) *
Ok thanks. I like the idea of having AP removal capabilities due to Xelor + Sram = lot of ap removal, although my gear is entirely air/fire since I don't play since may (or april, don't remember).
A lot may be an understatement if you build both classes for AP removal, you may remove even 10 action points! That's impossible you say? Entirely depends on base AP of your target and your luck. We all know that Xelor is capable of taking 8 on his own, and Sram traps, when triggered by your target, take effect after hypermovement has diminished - out of 8 attempted removals at least 2 ought to kick in. Guaranteed disable if you pull that off.
Again, you're drastically overestimating AP steal.

Max AP Steal % is 180%, after every AP stolen 20 hyperaction is added, meaning after 5AP stolen, you have an 80% chance for 6, 60% chance for 7, and 40% chance for 8. To successfully steal 8 you need all of those to succeed concurrently, meaning you need .8*.4*.2, which is 19.2% chance for success.

As if that wasn't bad enough, that requires 19AP to perform with Sandglass x3, Clock x2, Frostbite (And requires using frostbite which is a mediocre spell 9/10 times). So for 19AP you get 50x3 +105 x2+75 damage, or 435 damage. The same damage of a 14AP Air/Fire combination.

You'd be much better off damaging, as most end game Xelors can kill any single mob in the game for 19AP, unless it is a boss. Remember, almost all bosses at end game don't use AP to attack.

Even if all that works... that's 160 hyperaction, the mob will lose 10+5/maxAP hyperaction per turn meaning a 12AP mob would lose 70 Hyperaction, meaning that starting next turn you start with 90% to steal 1AP, 70% for 2, 50% for 3, 30% for 4, 10% for 5 and 0% from there.

Damage option or AP production is generally the better option as AP steal in PVM is almost entirely dedicated to bonus damage from aging.


Thread : Xelor  Preview message : #942756  Replies : 65  Views : 6653
posté February 09, 2016, 18:07:07 | #7
Oh, sorry. Yeah you can have unleveled spells. Keep in mind, though... once you start using them they will level at lightning speed... so the only time you'll ever have an unleveled spell is if you've never used it or you're fresh out of the respec room. Tri is good for flexibility, but Air/Fire will produce the highest damage the class can achieve without any of the extra frills.

And that is not how Hydrant works. Hydrant levels like a normal spell. The level of the spell cast by Hydrant = the level of the Hydrant spell. Same for Sinistro.


Thread : Xelor  Preview message : #942550  Replies : 65  Views : 6653
posté February 09, 2016, 17:39:32 | #8

Quote (Tiefoone @ 28 January 2016 07:54) *
If you want an easier way to access Mr. Punchy, make an alt, level it to 30 and then join it in the Respec Room (this obviously requires heroes). You can't respec your main but you can join the alt in the fight against Mr. Punchy.
Unless something has changed since the last time I tried to do this, it does not work. You cannot add heroes in the respec room.

Also, all the damage numbers are making me jelly, I guess I'll see what my weakling Xelor can do. It's gonna be nothing on that suicide-driver Rogue level. O_o


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #942545  Replies : 52  Views : 2065
posté February 08, 2016, 22:14:56 | #9
The scald cast is the same level as the Hydrant, but the Hydrant levels from being cast, not off the spell it casts.


Thread : Xelor  Preview message : #942420  Replies : 65  Views : 6653
posté February 08, 2016, 21:12:12 | #10

Quote (Aelorr @ 07 February 2016 01:57) *

Quote (hamster-guy @ 07 February 2016 01:44) *
It is worth levelling Hydrand if you want it for its damage. As it levels up, the spell the Hydrand casts also levels up.
Mhhhhh... So how do you handle leveling all that spell to maximum (for different specs) ?


Quote (Madd1 @ 05 February 2016 21:57) *
Nice

In topic with the original intention of this thread. I have started work on a Class Guide for Xelor which I will be posting in the 'Guides' sub forum in advanced tactics (that way I can leave this thread and it's information in tact for anyone who needs a more simple change based breakdown).

I will try to chapter out all the knowledge of Xelor I have to hopefully help newer players be able to grasp the complexity and massive preqrequisite knowledge of mechanics to play efficiently.

Basic warning for anyone who doesn't know me, in case you can't tell by the length of my 'survival guide'.... I write essays... This represents 3-4 years of my knowledge on the class, it's gonna be a long one. ^^
Can you point out which spells you leveled up? By reading your guides (and some topics where you answered, here and there), I noticed the following things:

  • You never use Underhand, maybe you use it only for defense (pushback) and not for the damage? Did you even level it? I can save a few points for your second AoE spec
  • Is Temporal Burn worth leveling? I think the damage comes all from temporal freeze, since you always cast burn with only 1 ap
  • I suppose you level aging for the last part of your turn: Hand + Burn. I'm trying to understand if you use one Xelor with those two specs, or you have two Xelors with those specs. I find hard getting all spells leveled up in a single character
  • When do you use clock? I couldn't find any reasonable situation, except for some AoE
This is a bit complicated to answer.... I've been an end-game or near end-game player since 2012, and the class was very different to play then and now.

Generally speaking, if I am focused on a singular characters spell experience, I will use the most efficient damage spells until they are maxed out, then I will move on to other spells until they max out.

This is VERY difficult to do in the early stages of the game because you will be leveling very, very fast and you may end up losing a lot of spell experience by maxing out your most efficient spells. An easy way to try and avoid this is to designate your primary spells, secondary spells and tertiary spells. Focus on using all of your primary damage spells all the time for maximum damage, but try to throw in a non-maxed secondary spell (that you know will not get maxed in that fight), this guarantees that you do not waste spell experience. As time progresses, you will max those secondary spells as well, at which point swap to your tertiary spells making sure to throw one in per fight so that your spell XP is not wasted.

Even if you do 'waste' spell XP, you gain it at a hugely boosted rate until it catches up with the spell XP your level is supposed to have. In the past, you could use respecs to even out the spell XP you had, which was very useful in the early stages of the game where spell XP tends to get most out of whack. Unfortunately, from my current experiences, this is no longer the case. I put my low lvl Xelor in the respec room around 79, and found that I could not max the 5/3 setup I expected, in fact I ended up doing something more like 4/2 because I was missing tons of spell XP. Not a big deal for me since I will get it back later when levels slow down, but it would be a bit of a hindrance for a newer player.

That said, I will use whatever spell a situation calls for. If I'm up against a strong vs fire, weak vs air target, I will likely either use a water/air combination or a pure air combination (you'll find all enemy instances to be situational and dependent on the spell damage you can produce with an optimal combination, vs the enemies resistances), in the instance that I need Pure Air, Underhand is generally my go-to simply because distortion is gated at 6AP, which is frequently not enough to finish off an enemy, later in the game. This is why I'd set aside primary necessary spells and secondary, less necessary or more supportive/situational spells, with tertiary have them just in case spells.

Burn is definitely worth leveling, however, Freeze was changed before release from Beta. It only triggers with 25% efficiency per AP spent in Burn. This means a 1AP burn triggers 25% of freeze, a 2AP burn triggers 50% of freeze and a 3AP burn triggers 75% of freeze, while a 5AP Hand triggers 100% of freeze (and is the only spell which can trigger for full damage). Burn is super useful, especially in Tri, where cross1 AoE combinations like Tock: Age, Clock, Clock, Burn or Tick: Age, Burn, Burn, Burn, Burn are possible. I'd say Burn is critical to small-AoE Xelor game.

I currently have one level 183 Xelor Tribrid PVM/PVP Xelor (Who pre spell decks I played as Air/Fire for 3 years), and years ago, when 110-125 was still the level cap I had two 110+ Xelors, one Fire/Air, one Water/Air. Currently, I'm raising a new Air/Fire Xelor to act as a pure PVM all out Damage Dealer. Any tri decks/pics I've posted come from Madd The Lost Soul, which is my 183 and are what I actually use on that char. The trick to understanding Xelor is understanding good dial placement, and the function of your tick/tock cycle (including your ability to manipulate it with Desynchronize).

An example of a Tick single target turn might be... Devote, Age, Hand, Hand, Burn. This gives you tons of bonus damage because aging triggers bonus damage from the initiative loss caused by Hand and Burn. Basically the damage looks like this... -42 air (age), -125 fire (hand), -60 air (from 25 init loss), -125 fire (hand), -60 air (from 25 init loss), -42 fire (burn), -19.2 air (init loss) for a total of 473.2, and that's an out of the gate 12AP combo that can be pulled off because Devotion will convert 2MP into 2AP. You can also potentially get more damage if you get lucky on Rollback (Assuming this is turn one and you also cast Dial you will get 6 chances to trigger rollback)

There are alternate options, but Air/Fire will provide the most reliable and consistent damage assuming that it lines up well with the resistances (as well as being the easiest to use and predict). Another possibility is Air/Water/Fire Tock turn: Devote, Distortion, Time Control Enemy, Age, Sandglass, Sandglass, Hand

This breaks down to -25 water (time control), -58 air (+10% triggered by TC distort), -42 air (Aging), -50 water (Sandglass), -17 air (AP steal), -50 water (Sandglass), -17 air (AP steal), -125 fire (Hand), -48 water (Freezing triggered at 100% by hand) for 432 or 437.8 real damage (when you count the 10% trigger of distort) and 173 of that damage would hit against -40% water res. If this was a turn one attack cycle, you'd use 8 spells and get 8 chances for rollback which also counts for potential damage.

but there's even trickier things you can do, like the Tick/Desynch similar run of the same turn. which could look like: Devote, Distortion, Distortion,Time Control Enemy, Time Control Self, Sandglass, Sandglass, Desynch into Tock, Hand, Burn.

This would produce -25 water (Time control), -116 air (distortion +10% from trigger), -50 water (sandglass), -50 water (sandglass), -125 fire (Hand), -48 water (100% Freeze trigger), -21 fire (Burn) for 435 or 446.6 effective damage after 10% trigger, of which 172 is triggered at -40% water res and provides 11 potential rollback attempts (which at 35% should theoretically trigger 3-4 AP on average that can be used in a variety of ways). This is why Tri just has the options to deal with any and all situations (single target wise).

Things start to get really tricky in later turns as you start to have off amounts of rollback AP to trigger with Timekeeper, but realistically... few dungeon fights last more than 3 turns outside of the boss room. So you have to find the balance in how you play between complexity and efficient speed.

However, such a convoluted turn is rarely necessary, or efficient, when you can generally 1Turn KO most things with Air/Fire. It's just another option available.

Side note: I don't understand the hydrant reference... Hydrant casts it's own spell, and that spell is 100% independent of the Xelor, much like a Sinistro doesn't level up your Frostbite, even though it casts it's own version of Frostbite. In older versions of the class, Sinistro cast Frostbite at your characters spell level, but this was changed years ago, and hydrant never operated that way. I do believe it briefly was intended to cast a 3AP Temporal Burn on all targets in range, but this never came to pass.

Hope that quick brain dump is helpful and organized enough for you to get the information you needed.... Sorry, I can't help but think this way ~_~


This post has been edited by Madd1 - February 08, 2016, 21:18:08.
Reason for edit : number corrections.
Thread : Xelor  Preview message : #942407  Replies : 65  Views : 6653
posté February 08, 2016, 20:26:13 | #11
I wish freeze stacked! The state disappears at the end of your turn, so it's trigger it or lose it :\

but yeah, the idea is to have the first function as position, primary buff/debuff and the second as 'clean up' buff/damage (or if I desynch them I could even have them alternate functionality, with the third operating as the primary buff target, and being used to trigger heavy redirected damage from the other two. Which essentially gives it an additional 12AP of damage at +10% final on top of whatever other buffs it receives, which in the comically specific 'You can only damage at certain times' of the current meta, would be ridiculously useful.

I wish Fronts was on, he'd be proud to hear me embracing distortion after I raged about hating it so much (I still think the spell is stupid, but it is comically useful the way current bosses work.)

Cool story, just tested and verified that Distortion forced trigger does not work with Time Control or Line of Fire. It appears forced trigger will only work with Aging... sometimes. As in it's not working 100% for me, and additionally.... it seems to only trigger randomly, sometimes just doing nothing at all. Additionally, no Xelor can target an enemy with Distortion if that enemy carries the state of another Xelor's distortion... Even if it was only cast once.

What a pain  

Additionally... there's a graphical glitch when playing two Xelors as hero where both will show the tick/tock state of your primary character.... lol this is just... ugh. I think I'll be sticking with two, XD


Thread : Xelor  Preview message : #942399  Replies : 6  Views : 264
posté February 06, 2016, 01:06:15 | #12

Quote (Zadistforlife @ 06 February 2016 01:02) *
Is Remington a ghost town?
No. Remington has had multiple communities forcibly merged into it and is now by far the largest English primary international community and I believe the second largest community, although the system to check the statistics on this information has since been disabled, so I can only produce information that is a couple of months old.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #941922  Replies : 3  Views : 109
posté February 06, 2016, 00:42:54 | #13
Uh excuse me, I have to submit a ticket with proof of IDENTITY to change my phone #? Phone #s aren't exactly social security IDs... Mine changed when I went to a work number for my personal number, and it's going to change again when I move OFF that system in the near future. So now I need to send you guys a grip of information to prove I'm myself?

That's real cute. Give me a better system than that please.


Thread : News  Preview message : #941917  Replies : 19  Views : 381
posté February 05, 2016, 23:14:45 | #14

Quote (HunterRabbitt @ 05 February 2016 21:50) *
There are weaknesses to a sadida, but you just haven't discovered them, neither will I tell you them. It is in fact possible to kill a tankdida, we are not undefeatable omniscient beings. So stop dramatizing it and learn, if you don't have the time don't start the fight.
Again, there are people beating Sadidas in 1v1.

Who cares. 1v1 is about as meaningful as anything that comes out of Donald Trump's mouth.

That's not the problem with the class. The problem is how poorly it performs in most scenarios and how stupidly well it performs in others. There's no other class that has such a messed up power-scaling over the course of a fight, starting off as total garbage, and ending up far beyond any other class at max potential.

It's a class that needs to have its roles assessed and defined, then be reworked to correctly achieve these goals without overstepping or understepping them, like it does now.


Thread : General  Preview message : #941902  Replies : 243  Views : 8287
posté February 05, 2016, 23:02:31 | #15
Are you sure? I used to have to plant for members when they'd plvl alts. Still, the lack of granular permissions really needs to be addressed.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #941899  Replies : 69  Views : 1308
posté February 05, 2016, 21:57:10 | #16
Nice

In topic with the original intention of this thread. I have started work on a Class Guide for Xelor which I will be posting in the 'Guides' sub forum in advanced tactics (that way I can leave this thread and it's information in tact for anyone who needs a more simple change based breakdown).

I will try to chapter out all the knowledge of Xelor I have to hopefully help newer players be able to grasp the complexity and massive preqrequisite knowledge of mechanics to play efficiently.

Basic warning for anyone who doesn't know me, in case you can't tell by the length of my 'survival guide'.... I write essays... This represents 3-4 years of my knowledge on the class, it's gonna be a long one. ^^


Thread : Xelor  Preview message : #941890  Replies : 65  Views : 6653
posté February 05, 2016, 21:44:22 | #17
This is an interesting conundrum, because it includes elements that require huge time investment from players, and therefore has to be dealt with very carefully.

The technical limitations are definitely a large problem, and I don't think they will ever be something that can be solved, however the limitation imposed by these problems is that shrinking, or very small guilds that were at one point large or even humongous (such as mine) will have legacy havenworlds.

I am not in any way willing to give up our HW as we put insane effort into finishing and maximizing it, but at this point our guild only has a handful of active players and I just don't have the time to revive it in my current life schedule. However, if the company were to take my havenworld away because my guild had a low population, I'd quit this game in a heartbeat and never look back. That's just flat out rude, and disrespectful to the thousands of hours of work I and my other guild members have put into making it what it is and I would not tolerate it from a company that wants me to pay them.

As time progresses, there will definitely be an influx of guilds and players in this situation, with the current limitations, it's only a matter of time before most if not all havenworlds are occupied this way.

I think the better long term solution for Ankama is to work out an alliance system in which the parent guild (or alliance as an entity as it would be possible to make an alliance it's own parent guild) the only thing allowed to purchase and own havenworlds, with current havenworld owners given a set timeframe with which to form an alliance and convert.

It's much easier to manage inactivity on a larger scale such as an alliance, because it would be very easy for a larger, older set of inactive guilds to pull in younger hungrier guilds.

This better serves to both help newer players, and keep everyone supplied with their own havenworld space.

On that topic, Ankama _BADLY_ needs to work on the permissions accessible to people given by 'havenworld access'. Anyone I want to let plant mobs in my havenworld now has access to destroy all my buildings. That's just dumb. There should really be tiered access for things like:
  • Planting Mobs
  • Planting resources
  • Harvesting resources
  • Destroying Mobs
  • Opening Guild Doors (maybe even a second set of crafted doors only for higher guild ranks, or maybe even tiers of door)
  • Moving objects or buildings
  • Creating objects or buildings
  • Destroying objects or buildings
That's my two cents on the matter, for what it's worth.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #941888  Replies : 69  Views : 1308
posté February 05, 2016, 21:17:17 | #18

Quote (EarthyMadness @ 05 February 2016 18:12) *
Some of those riktus players are still active, but with lesser ranks than they had in that link.
That list is so old, half of it is no longer Riktus, lol.... Monte nation changed after he left Borg for Asylum, I assume so he could use heroes.

Both of Elenore's chars are top 20 in Brak now, and Pandas. I believe Ebonii went Bonta, though I could be wrong about that...

That list reminds me of better times. Back when PVP wasn't a 100% scummy affair, when you could actually get real group combat and nation fights and other fun stuff.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #941886  Replies : 10  Views : 634
posté February 05, 2016, 21:11:41 | #19
I still do 1-90 at Sadida on werewolves. 1 turn fights 90% of the time, pretty much 4-6 hours to lvl 90 at max.


Thread : General Discussion  Preview message : #941884  Replies : 32  Views : 1291
posté February 04, 2016, 09:39:58 | #20

Quote (Infirc @ 04 February 2016 03:07) *
it's easy you just add a "weight" to Control, in Pve control stays the same, in pvp it'd take 2 control points to achieve what 1 control point does in Pve, that way you have a balance without nerfing a class that honestly needs a lot of help to actually function.
Still wouldn't be fun to play, and would be no better off in PVM for people who weren't doll abusing to begin with.


Thread : General  Preview message : #941682  Replies : 243  Views : 8287